Responses to banning of members

[Bernie]

Originally Posted by remicks

*****

Bernie,

Thank you for explaining the situation with Pete Denis , because for the majority of us knowing very little of what was taking place .... a sudden ban like that is unnerving. It's too bad when that becomes the final solution and its important to hear that it was used as a last resort.

Thank you for understanding. I need to keep other member's feelings in mind and perhaps communicate a little better in that respect, but didn't want to make a bad thing worse. Either way, I want to assure all the members that banning is something I do NOT do just for the heck of it. I don't feel that any of the regulars here have anything to fear regarding that. I will do my best along with help from the wonderful forum moderators, Johan and Russ to keep things running smoothly and that everyone gets along in a fun, spirited though respectful manner.

I think we're all on edge a little bit right now with the sudden death of Barry Lederer. Or at least I can speak for myself in this respect.

I'm so sad at his passing. And I'm also quite angry. Here was a man who knew SO MUCH about the disco scene ..could tell us so much ...and now he is gone without having done so.

His inputs would have been so welcomed here. What he added to the main part of the site is just a taste of his experiences.

Why didn't he come here more and share things ?? Why not participate on these discussion boards?? That is what I'd like to ask directly of him , and now of course I can't .

Barry did leave his legacy behind. For those who don't know, just look at the main DiscoMusic.com site as you've stated.

DiscoMusic.com
Barry Lederer of Graebar Sound - DiscoMusic.com

Bless his soul, but Barry would constantly drive me nuts that he was having trouble posting, or lost his password/username... In many ways he felt a little intimidated with the forums and preferred to post quietly in the main section of DiscoMusic.com especially in the "Clubs" section. He appears there under a number of different names. He also posted a number of things and gave interviews for other sites as well so he did get the word out to anyone who would listen. He was actually quite good at that and left us with some great stories and history on Disco and the culture so he certainly did his best.

So, I am asking that of ALL OF YOU that lurk here yet don't dive in and participate. LURKING adds NOTHING and here is this wonderful gathering place and depository for us to document and share and enjoy all that is and was good about disco .... You know what , and even all that wasn't good because let's be honest ....we all have very painful memories from those days as well as the glory. It was a very scary and heart wrenching time as friends were dropping left and right. Many many people from this scene were gone way too soon . And now Barry .


And guess what? Its going to happen to me and its going to happen to you too!!

This place is your chance to share experiences and use your voice while you can!

I pray that somehow all this will be preserved ....that Bernie you will not let all thats been gathered here one day just vanish. And when all of us are gone ... as will happen ....maybe further down the line this will be viewed as a precious reference.

The documentation of the experiences of those that were there then .... AND those that are here now that are exploring it still or anew..... we need to document this disco fever while it exists.

Thank you for encouraging others to participate. The only way this site will stick around is if everyone joins in and becomes active.

That now brings me to one of our dearest contributers Quinny. He is someone that indeed has stepped up to the plate and given quite a bit of himself to this site ....what is it 3,500 posts or so over the course of many years.
He was here when I first came on board , we tangled right away , and I learned to adjust to him .... just like we adjust to all kinds of people in our various walks of life. In fact, his answers I learned to particularly looked forward to as much as any others ... because he was willing to give it to you straight. And that's nothing to get all sensitive about.

I don't know the specifics of his removal ...but just like Pete Denis it's unnerving when someone is just thrown off the disco train for reasons unknown. Maybe for justified reasons , but for us looking on ...we don't know that. We just know that someone who's been an active part of our lives is now gone. And in Quinnys case it is particularly troubling because he has been here a long time and I think of him as a friend. A friend who has just suddenly unexpectedly disappeared.

The banning of Quinny is not one that came easy for me. In fact, I like him, his vast knowledge, his ability to convey a thought, go against common wisdom... and learned to deal with his sometimes abrasive posts. However many members were saying they had stopped participating because of him and every time I gave him another chance he would soon do something that would send an avalanche of complaints my way. He knew what the rules were, he knew he was rubbing people the wrong way and needed to act in a more civil manner. Each time he promised me he would change and I believe he was sincere, but it would never truly materialize.

I don't mean to use this as an excuse and I never wanted it to be public although Johan was aware of it, but my girlfriend of eight years just barely survived cancer surgery earlier this year and it's still hairy. Every time another problem with Quinny came up it just pissed me off to no end. Here I was wondering if my life would get any worse and then I had to deal with trivial bullshit regarding Quinny and the forum again and again. I had enough and banned him. Believe me, there is a part of me that wants to bring him back, but the nonsense will just start all over again and I don't think that I or anyone here has to put up with that. I mean, I get the privilege of spending thousands of dollars each year to keep this site running so he can piss all over it and disrespect the members ? No way. Life is too short and I'm going to concentrate on more positive things.

Not different in some ways from the way Barry Lederer has suddenly left us . Its a loss to this community.

If it matters .... as a contributer who cares about this site and is grateful for it........ without benefit of knowing the details that caused it ...I oppose Quinnys removal.

He obviously has the passion for disco that makes him a worthwhile compatriot.

Thanks Bernie for your time ....this is all something I feel so strongly about.... thank you for discomusic.com .... .

No, thank you for taking time to post in an intelligent and thoughtful way. I respect and appreciate that.

ALL YOU LURKERS OUT THERE ... Better get on the stick!!

Take Barry Lederers sudden death to heart ... Bernie's been gracious enough to provide the place ... why not make use of it .
PARTICIPATE !!!! please !!

While you can......while you're blessed to be able to !!!!!



peace amongst us



remicks





*****

[Mixmachine]

saved for another day , maybe.

[paul]

Bernie,
I sincerely wish your girlfriend a speedy recovery and you to remain in good spirit.

[paul]

Let me also add that perhaps it's time for us...well me, to just ease down and take a few moments away from this.

[Mixmachine]

Originally Posted by paul

Let me also add that perhaps it's time for us...well me, to just ease down and take a few moments away from this.

you're right.

[markydefad]

Bernie,

I'm saddened to hear about the troubles with your girlfriend's health. I truly hope she recovers and your life gets back to normal.

Regarding Pete Denis, I had no idea, until he posted something here this week, that he was the same Vyniljunkie who played the role of the Vault Troll and wrote nasty comments on people's additions. [ For members: Check out what he did to tmob's selections....all of which were primo and rare--but somehow didn't meet his standards....he started attacking him mercilessly until Bernie interceded....but tmob told me that was it for him. He hasn't added anything since.]

Just what the site needs-- A Bullying Vault Troll--who has to rate every record posted to see if he approves and if he doesn't, relentlessly attacks the poster.

I realize Mixmachine has a friendship with him--but I've also read his posts and messages on people's pages and he seems very unstable and delusional and, I probably shouldn't say it--but quite ignorant in terms of understanding what good disco was. He boasts about his knowledge and yet doesn't recognize the value of really special rare things and instead of trying to learn something...attacks it as crap.

[For members: Go read it for yourself....start with Margaret Singana's "Where Is The Love" that tmob posted and then the William Goldstein & the Magic Disco Machine "Midnight Rhapsody" post that brought him to boil..

DiscoMusic.com

then see his comments on all of tmob's posts:

[ this is from an email I sent to tmob--a former DJ and record pool manager and very expert disco collector, that lays out the timeline]

you caught his eye on 3/17 with the Frank Sinatra
you riled him on 3/17 with Margaret Singana
you brought him to boil on 3/18 with Wm Goldstein

Then he tore into:
8:45 am California
8:47 am Adrienne Ste.Claire
8:48 am Lou Courtney
8:50 am Julie
8:52 am Cerrone
8:54 am RCA sampler
8:55 am Tavares
8:56 am Dionne Warwicke

Then Bernie interceded and told him to back off. I wasn't aware that he was bullying other posters who added stuff to the Vault. But that kind of behavior is uncalled for. Especially when he's stone-cold stupid about the value of the records he's trashing!!! ]

As for Quinny, it is more problematic for me. I fought with him from day one. I'd post something and he'd lay a turd on my post, incensing me. However, over the years, I learned to ignore him and grudgingly, respect his knowledge and very unique way of expressing himself. We haven't done battle for a long time and I rather grew accustomed to the fact that he would find a contratrian viewpoint on most of what was posted and, therefore, launch a firestorm with the newbies that didn't get him. Oh, that again. Yawn.

Bernie, I don't envy you the decisons you have to make. It must get really tiresome, especially when you have far more pressing issues to deal with.

Thanks for clarifying the situation. I never really know what goes on behind the scenes. I rarely complain about people here to the management, with one exception late last year--someone who was laying in wait to get people in trouble and bullying them with his incessant snide comments. So I did complain on that one--but I confronted him openly before I complained.

But I wouldn't want the job of having to keep all the egos soothed. Video and Russ do a fine job of guiding and explaining the site to the newcomers...hopefully easing your burden with the day to day crap.

Hope things get better.

[Bernie]

I'm not looking to rain on Remicks wonderful post, but I feel everyone should see this e-mail that Pete Denis sent me today. As I mentioned in the "Kid Creole a.k.a. August Darnell" post, Pete has been barraging me with e-mail after rambling e-mail full of nonsense, insults and threats. As of this writing it is now up to three e-mails today alone and it's still the afternoon. One of those I received today takes a twist and shows his real agenda. I love how he now accuses me of being gay and siding with them (both wrong), that the site has been dormant (wrong), that he gave the site a needed "shot in the arm" (what planet is he on?) and finally that priceless last paragraph... oh hell, just read it for yourselves:

BERNIE, TOLD YOU I WOULDN'T STAND IDLY BYE- Twelve sites got this yesterday. Next is BILLBOARD, ROLLING STONE and others. I hear that your siding with all your GAY friends is causing quite a stir with your straight members, get ready to kiss them goodbye as well. You are going to BAN a lot of your members!! Kiss your $$$$ goodbye, you may have NEW competition too, there goes your revenue! Your lifestyle! You CHOSE the wrong side. Screwed up! I am going to let you know all my moves, every step I will take to hurt your business. Just so you can learn a lesson. Should have stuck with your own kind, or are you GAY? Foolish man!! THIS IS WHAT IS CALLED "FREEDOM OF SPEECH"
What are my thoughts on DISCOMUSIC.COM? Well, I just got banned from that site, despite being the number one commenter, by over 4000 points. In three months I contributed more quality and quantity writing then the site had in the previous twelve years. But I said honest comments that the egos that run that site didn't want to hear. Egotistical deejays like Steven L Freeman and site owner Bernie Lopez rejected my opinions and views, and decided to stop me from expressing my thoughts and words. A hypocritical action when you consider all that DISCO itself went through. Remember how all of the "establishment" of the 70's tried to stop DISCO? But thanks to the first amendment of our constitution, DISCO was heard loud and clear(with a good set of Speakers). That same right that Bernie Lopez has taken away from me helped give him a job. There is an uproar by visitors and members. This is not the first time that opposing or dissenting opinions have been silenced by the Big Brother leadership of DISCOMUSIC.COM. There is a clear pattern and history of a repression of speech on this site. Many others have been BANNED because of contrary beliefs, most recently a long time member called QUINNY. Then there is the sexual orientation issues. It used to be that DISCO MUSIC brought the GAY and STRAIGHT together. But DISCOMUSIC.COM has retarded the progress made in the last thirty years and created a large gap in Disco lovers today. The GAY influence has caused the straight to keep silent, or risk expulsion from the site . This WAS, in my opinion a great idea, and possibly at one time a great site. But today its membership is in distress, as the straight try not to rock the boat fearing that their opposing views and comments will lead to getting reprimanded and BANNED. If they could do it the the only rising star that that site had, to the one guy who doubled some of the pages and contents that had been dormant for years(in three months). The guy who had given this site a much needed shot in the arm, they realize that they better shut up or they too could get BANNED. So how do I feel about the site? I THOUGHT that it was the best thing since DISCO itself. I now realize that it was a wolf in sheep's clothing, or a Trojan Horse. It lured me in, made me want it, then turned ugly and and it's censorship reminds me of 1941 NAZI Germany. A ruthless leader whose misguided ambitions and actions hurt many that few know about. He censors authors and the media, he demands total surrender or he will unleash his PITBULL to get you. Next He will demand that your right arm be raised as we sing his praise in front of his book-burning party!!!

Feel free to make of the above as you wish. All I ask is that members remain calm and not let this guy get to them. Feel free to state your position, but keep it civil please. Lastly, let the record stand that I side with no one particular person or group as this site has always been inclusive-and will remain so. My main goal is for everyone to enjoy themselves while respecting the views and backgrounds of others.

[BrunoRepublic]

Originally Posted by Bernie

The banning of Quinny is not one that came easy for me. In fact, I like him, his vast knowledge, his ability to convey a thought, go against common wisdom... and learned to deal with his sometimes abrasive posts.

I feel the same way. I guess I just learned to ignore his often acerbic tone, and after a while it just didn't bother me at all. At least he had a lot of experience and plenty of interesting things to say. I don't know whether he simply didn't realize how needlessly confrontational he came across or he simply didn't care, but in the end I suppose it doesn't matter.

Sorry to hear about your girlfriend, Bernie. I can't even imagine how difficult that must be to deal with. Anyway, I'll be contacting you soon about a new project I'm working on.

[STEPHEN L FREEMAN]

Bernie & Marky... Thanks for bringing the information to light.
It's, at the very least, a relief to know I wasn't the only one receiving insessant fire-balls of crazy.
I stopped responding after his 2nd letter because it would've become akin to putting out fire, with gasoline.
And thankfully, I was able to semi-delete the public animosity from my profile page.

I'd post the letters I received, prior to his leaving, but the amount of profanity would make editing them too time-consuming.

And, quite honestly, you'd think he'd spell my name correctly, by now...

[markydefad]

I stand by delusional and unstable.

[STEPHEN L FREEMAN]

Originally Posted by Bernie

I don't mean to use this as an excuse and I never wanted it to be public although Johan was aware of it, but my girlfriend of eight years just barely survived cancer surgery earlier this year and it's still hairy.

I've been exactly where you are, Bernie. I know just how it feels.
I appreciate your, publicly sharing something so personal.
With the positive energy coming at you from 100's of site members, you'll both come through, just fine!

[Videoskooter]

Remicks, that was a very moving post and in fact a great tribute to Barry!

[Mixmachine]

This situation could have been avoided very easily by banning from the get go all parties involved in the dispute and in this way dispelling any sense of favoritism either real or perceived, this sort of thing happened here in this forums before, and led to a similar situation with Bernie!!!


When there is a fight in a club the bouncers remove from the premises all parties involved, the club owner should not be interested on who said what first or when, the only mitigating fact of importance is that both parties were violently fighting within the walls of the club (threats in a this forum in this case) and this constitutes a violation of the rules by both parties not just one!.



It take two to Tango!!!! and fair is fair!!


Let them take their issues outside the forum..

To ban only one of the participants is bound to cause remorse, and in this case out of control indignation from the “wronged” party.

And certain member here should stop flirting in public forum with perfect strangers if you want to be respected!!; this behavior is bound to lead to future mis-calculations by some members here giving rise to a situation like we have here now!! This all started with an innocent flirt that was blown out of proportion!!!!!by an insulting BULLING comment from a third non-participant party, now here proclaiming innocence.

You don't address a man by calling them "DUDE" unless you mean disrespect!!!!!! and the "try to behave as a gentleman " is also designed to insult!! by insunuating that you are less than a gentleman, this remark below is an INSULT!!!

DUDE! You're addressing a Lady. Try to behave like a gentleman." by Stephen Freeman

[Mixmachine]

Originally Posted by markydefad

Regarding Pete Denis, I had no idea, until he posted something here this week, that he was the same Vyniljunkie who played the role of the Vault Troll and wrote nasty comments on people's additions. [ For members: Check out what he did to tmob's selections....all of which were primo and rare--but somehow didn't meet his standards....he started attacking him mercilessly until Bernie interceded....but tmob told me that was it for him. He hasn't added anything since.]

and he apologized twice, in one instance before Bernie interceded, besides this is all coming from an overly enthusiastic man that just got a PC for the first time and discovered a Disco board to boot!!!! His comment were nothing but trivial kids stuff that no one should take seriously.

He attacked numerous of my postings too, some in a pretty nasty way, check under my name if you doubt me, check and see if I cared one bit, or if I called on Uncle Bernie to protest, I didn't even reply or email him, just not important!!!!

Just what the site needs-- A Bullying Vault Troll--who has to rate every record posted to see if he approves and if he doesn't, relentlessly attacks the poster.

If you want to read an example of an attacking bullying post in the vault area, when simply ignoring it, or even better, posting the appropriate correction right after the questionable post without addressing the poster and thus avoiding the insulting remark(s), check this exchange against Pete Denis, pretty malicious and INSULTING!! if you ask me, and speaks volumes to what happened here with Pete, looks to me someone had an old ax to grind from the moment they spotted Pete and got their chance for revenge here in this board.

Don Ray - DiscoMusic.com

I realize Mixmachine has a friendship with him--

For the record I haven't seen this guy since the early/mid 80's, and now I don't think he deserves a second change, but he was provoked here and if he was banned for this then the OTHER PARTY should be Ban too!!!!

[Bernie]

Thank you guys for your heartfelt wishes for my girlfriend's full recovery. It really means a lot. Thank you.