Hard-To-Mix Songs

[Ricardo_Mata]

Hi! Rading the messages about mixes, breaks, and so forth made me think about some songs I could never mix with anything else.

One of those songs was Patrick Hernandez's "Born To Be Alive." The BPMs are pretty high and the hi-hat is so loud and noticeable that I could never match it to anything.

I also had two other songs I always had trouble with but I can't remember their titles right now. I guess I'm getting old...

[The Lord of Flatbush]

On 2002-05-12 20:11, Ricardo_Mata wrote:
Hi! Rading the messages about mixes, breaks, and so forth made me think about some songs I could never mix with anything else.

One of those songs was Patrick Hernandez's "Born To Be Alive." The BPMs are pretty high and the hi-hat is so loud and noticeable that I could never match it to anything.

I also had two other songs I always had trouble with but I can't remember their titles right now. I guess I'm getting old...

If you're recording flat, you can bring down the level in volume of the track on the mixer in order to match the level with the other track. Trust me, you're not getting old and I've done it on many occasions.

[Ricardo_Mata]

Thanks! What song do you mix "Born..." with?

[Robbie]

I like to envision mixes in my mind, and one that I'd love to do (if I knew how to mix on vinyl) is Paradise Express' "Dance" and mix the ending of that song with the intro to Patrick Hernandez' "Born To Be Alive". I think it'd sound pretty good. There's a segment on "Dance" towards the end that sounds like another record is mixing into it but it's really not. I think that would be a great place to mix it.

[JussiK]

Theo Vaness: Sentimentally It's You - ?

[sifurich]

On 2002-05-12 20:11, Ricardo_Mata wrote:
Hi! Rading the messages about mixes, breaks, and so forth made me think about some songs I could never mix with anything else.

One of those songs was Patrick Hernandez's "Born To Be Alive." The BPMs are pretty high and the hi-hat is so loud and noticeable that I could never match it to anything.

I also had two other songs I always had trouble with but I can't remember their titles right now. I guess I'm getting old...

On that particular song I like to mix out of it towards the very end, and not at the break. I start to mix at about the last 3mins of the song, just fade it out, the beats dont change at the end of the song. Hope this helps..

[johnceglia]

JussiK is right on the money.

[JussiK]

Actually, mate, in June/July 1979 in New York where I first herd Theo, every time BORN TO BE ALIVE was spinned - and it was spinned a lot, A LOT - they seemed to seque it into SENTIMENTALLY IT'S YOU. Larry Levan used this mix. You danced to it at 12 West, tried to avoid the coked up evening elegance wearing, nasty, sweating "beautiful people" at the horribly overhyped Studio 54 to it. The tracks came at you everywhere. So much in fact that some dancers were already screaming the "YOU!!!!" bit from Theo's song half way thru BORN.... Still, the djs went on not surprising us punters which was very surprising, the place being New York, at that time THE place to be!

[JussiK]

Oh, and I forgot to add, naturally I could not wait to the seque myself when I got home.

[nrgbeat]

I have trouble mixing "Good Times" by Chic.

A few weeks ago I was trying to mix "Good Times" into "Bounce, Rock, Skate, Roll" and kept messing it up.

[Rugger57]

The song I always had a problem with is "Gimme A Break" by Vivian Vee. I couldn't find anything to match the conga's at the end of the song, and it seemed that the percussion didn't hold beat.

[Jimmy-Michaels]

"Born To Be Alive" can go into many tunes easy...it's just a matter of being quick with the pitch control and using your hand on the spindel to bring it in and force it like most disco records (assuming we're talkin real live mixing here)...

ive gone in and out of that one to so many tunes I can't even name em all. The key coming into it from something is to cue it right at the part where the single version begins and sneak it up crossfade slowly but quickly (and again, physicly jerking the record with your hand to keep it at whatever steady bpm you need). Then getting out of it...when the long instrumental section comes about middle of the 12", you can go into practicly anything...

Dont concentrate on "beat" or "bassline" mixing...go for the midrange sounds...whoever said Theo Vaness "Sentementally It's You"...your right on the money! Thats a good one to go into. The main one I used to do was Machine "There But For The Grace Of God"...id either do a quick crossfade or id ride the entire first verse over the instrumental section of "Born.." then as the chorus came in totaly drop the faders into it.


If you wanna know a few real tough ones due to unsteady BPMs but using the same method as "Born.." you can do it..

"The Beat Goes On" - Ripple and "Hold Your Horses" - First Choice...PAIN IN THE ASS, but can be done.

[Jimmy-Michaels]

I have trouble mixing "Good Times" by Chic.

A few weeks ago I was trying to mix "Good Times" into "Bounce, Rock, Skate, Roll" and kept messing it up.

"Good Times" can go into that one nicely if you pitch up "Bounce.." or pitch down Chic and again...it's a matter of physicly working it in with your hand like I was talkin bout in the post above.

[canadiantire]

The song I always had a problem with is "Gimme A Break" by Vivian Vee. I couldn't find anything to match the conga's at the end of the song, and it seemed that the percussion didn't hold beat.

You are so right about this cut!

The intro is about as hard as the outro to mix.

You can hear by yourself a try that I did a while ago:

Click here to listen to: test-mix

Ok, ok it's cheating because these songs are from different music styles, different era but when you have to do it, you do it anyway you can...


I'm sure there are other tracks that would make a better transition.


If you want a similar challenge, try an overlap of more than 5 seconds with: Kelly Marie - Loving Just for Fun with anything you can think of...it becomes a true horror show...

It's just as bad as Vivien Vee.


- Marcus

[pepper1dancer]

The intro is about as hard as the outro to mix.

You can hear by yourself a try that I did a while ago:

Click here to listen to: test-mix


Hey, Thats a cool mix. Makes me want to go out tonight. Last weekend in Dallas, I heard on the dance floor, "Rollercoaster" then came in "Heaven Must've sent you" That was awesome

[eddieo]

Relying on my long-faded memory....., during the 70s I had trouble with most Earth Wind and Fire (I chalked it up to their jazz-like musicianship), especially September. In the 90s I remember being forced to play Prince's Let's Go Crazy (she was in the house) and it gave me rash, getting in and getting out.

[Simon White]

I've always been curious as to how easily Eddie Kendricks 'Girl You Need A Change Of Mind' was mixed either in or out of a record?

I cannot mix to save my life even on a computer and the early live mixers must have had it very hard indeed with changing tempos and inconsistent non electronic beats !

[QUINNY]

To be 'on the money' with almost any records pre-1980 or thereabouts was damned difficult. Nearly every one had minor changes in tempii which made beat mixing a chore at times.

The problems occurred because human drummers are not programmed to be absolutely 100% accurate and in the music we're discussing, feel was just as important as precision. Add to that the fact that click tracks weren't used on some recordings and........voila!

A live drummer would be bloody tired after maybe 6 or 7 minutes of what could be hard, physical, highly concentrated work (not all 12"/album cuts were cut and paste jobs), so some drifting in tempo could only be expected.

Two of the worst records for mixing that I ever came across were:-
Ain't No Stoppin' Us Now - McFadden & Whitehead in the late middle, instrumental section where it dramatically speeds up from its average BPM to about 4-5 BPM more, in an instant. I'm assuming this is due to a cut and paste of a segment from another take that was screwed up on the released take.

Turn The Music Up - Players Association after the break. Ditto the above 'cos it definitely sounds like an edit has taken place and once again it speeds up considerably, in a flash.

[Mixmachine]

Two of the worst records for mixing that I ever came across were:-
Ain't No Stoppin' Us Now - McFadden & Whitehead in the late middle, instrumental section where it dramatically speeds up from its average BPM to about 4-5 BPM more, in an instant. I'm assuming this is due to a cut and paste of a segment from another take that was screwed up on the released take.

Here is a quick and dirty "hit & run" short beatmixing blend out of "Ain't no" into "Heaven must be missing" the remix, this is from an 80's club during an oldies set, as I remember everyone always loved this sets.

Mix_clip

PS: By the way Peper1dancer's clip above always crashes my Firefox browser session, I just fell for it again just now, wonder why ?

[Mixmachine]

Actually, mate, in June/July 1979 in New York where I first herd Theo, every time BORN TO BE ALIVE was spinned - and it was spinned a lot, A LOT - they seemed to seque it into SENTIMENTALLY IT'S YOU. Larry Levan used this mix. You danced to it at 12 West, tried to avoid the coked up evening elegance wearing, nasty, sweating "beautiful people" at the horribly overhyped Studio 54 to it. The tracks came at you everywhere. So much in fact that some dancers were already screaming the "YOU!!!!" bit from Theo's song half way thru BORN.... Still, the djs went on not surprising us punters which was very surprising, the place being New York, at that time THE place to be!

"Born to be alive" (134 bpm) was so popular and for so long, that it was probably mixed with just about every similar record in that bpm range, including older popular cuts and many fresh ones that came later.

"Sentimentally is you" @ +/- 138 bpm was a perfect match in many ways and universally used by many Djs at the time. Especially given the popularity of Theo Vaness' song.

Among the many other tunes used, was "The Runner" by the Three degrees.

Here is a small clip taken from a 1979 tape recorded at club Alexandre in Downtown Miami, Florida.

Born to be alive --> The Runner

[Ian Rose]

Sooooooo many disco records gain a few bpm by the end, because of the drummers losing steam and speeding up a bit.
I hate having to re cue the next record constantly all the way through...
Maybe it just me,..but Phreek-Weekend..kills me, it speeds up so fast off the bat. GO drop/slam mixing!!

[eddieo]

Sooooooo many disco records gain a few bpm by the end, because of the drummers losing steam and speeding up a bit.
I hate having to re cue the next record constantly all the way through...
Maybe it just me,..but Phreek-Weekend..kills me, it speeds up so fast off the bat. GO drop/slam mixing!!

I don't know if I concur that "many disco records gain a few bpm by the end", but it reminds me that my technique was to have the "new" record pitched a bit fast, then dragging it with a finger to match tempos. That way, most necessary corrections could be made by changing finger pressure. I've seen others pinch the center spindle to achieve this, but I was always a platter-dragger. This would be my excuse for why my sets typically built to faster and faster tempo, till culminating with a record that ends cold, out of which I'd start the whole process over again back around 112 or so. It's also the reason I never warmed to CD-mixing, which most of my colleagues did embrace. For my money, few songs lend themselves to an effective quick-cut or slam. Just my $.02

[osses]

Wild Cherry -Disco Music Band...it goes normal and changes in the chorus...love that track but hate to mix it