Mixing with CD's

[Masdefi]

I was in a club-restaurant last night and a disco 70 night was organized. A very good selection from 70ies all from CD's. The music was so good that the people was dancing also into the bathroom.

But I was wondering how is it possible to mix with CD's, how could you couple two different BPM's? I didn't see if there was a pitch control.

[nrgbeat]

Cd players with pitch control have been on the market for about ten years now in the U.S.

Denon and Pioneer are two companies that produce these.

[DJ P]

Hi Masdefi, as the other poster stated there are cd's units that have 'pitch controls'. I own a Numark 'CD Mix-1' that has two pitch controlled cd players, a mixer that is in the center of the console and inputs for two turntables (which I have and use, more vinyl than cds at this time). Each of the cd players in this device has a 'shuttle' or also known as a 'jog wheel'. This knob (about 4" in size) subsitutes for the edge of the vinyl us old dj's are used to. The shuttle wheel allows us to 'slip cue' a cd (matching the up or down beat depending on your preference) to execute a mix. The Numark mixer/cd player was under $400 U.S. dollars. For me it was money well spent. I now have a new mixer and two pitch controlled cd players and alot less 'cables' in my home dj booth. Shop around as you can buy 'solo' cd players (instead of two and the mixing panel) if you only want one to hook up to your own system. Hope this info helps you. All the best, Phil

[markydefad]

Stupid question, but is it any easier to mix using the cd mixer than it is using the vinyl and turntables? Is there like a bpm counter in the CD mixer? Someone mentioned such a thing in some machine. It seems that would be helpful in getting the beats in perfect sync. This was always the hardest thing for me to get right--those damn pesky beats. Plus I hated the sound of the music when it was pitched up or down too much.

_________________
Make My Feet Wanna Dance!

Markydefad

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: markydefad on 2002-04-29 19:20 ]</font>

[DJ P]

Hi Markydefad, yes the Numark CD-1 has a built-in BPM counter for each cd drive on the mixer. Unfourtanly when mixing vinyl the BPM isn't in effect. Til you get used to mixing cds, vinly is alot easier to control. The one benifit of cd's that is easier to do is 'echoing/rimming'. You can place a cd four beats behind the other and it will stay constant throuhout the song. The old effect of 'rimming' (playing a piece of the same song on vinyl a 'mil-a-second' ahead or behind to give an 'electronic' distortion effect is also easier). The device has several 'bells and whistles' built into it that does help mixing cds. It takes awhile to get used to it, but with practice it can easily be mastered. In the early '80's I dj'ed a 'New Wave' nite (and also was a Light Tech) at a large club in the Clearwater, Florida area. That club was one of the first to deal with cd mixers. We had two seperate 'Sony' players hooked up to our mixer (along with three turntables, two stereo video decks and three wireless mikes) in the booth. That club's system and layout was the best in this area at the time. All the best, Phil

_________________
Evolution only pertains to Disco, and the beat goes on...

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: DJ Phil on 2002-04-29 19:34 ]</font>

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: DJ Phil on 2002-04-29 19:43 ]</font>

[nrgbeat]

I always thought it would be easier mixing with vinyl because it's more hands on. (i.e. you can touch the vinyl.)

On the Denon cd player I have, it has a pitch bend button but no jog wheel. I assuming the jog wheel might be easier in getting the beats in sync.

Those live drummers are a BITCH to mix!!
I have to time the intro of the song and then time the break to make sure the bpm's haven't changed.

[DJ P]

Hi nrgbeat, as in my earlier post: I prefer vinyl over cd mixing. Yes the jog wheels do make mixing easier. If the live drumming (the various 'ebbs and flows' of the 'drumming) of the older Disco releases is bothersome, try some of the remix services (Hot Tracks, Ultimix). They have several 'Classic' releases where thier dj's have electronically corrected the errors of the live drummers, made a new mix, made easy to use breaks and added a little 'spark' (without ruining the song) of thier own to the mix. Some have collections of music on sale while other's may be running some specials. Check them out and I think you will be surprised and happy at what you find. Hope my reply helps, Phil

[nonkel808]

Yo Masdefi!

Nowadays theres also new way of mixin with CD's! The Pioneer CDJ-1000 !
This is an incredible Cd player, that can be handled like a Vinyl recordplayer!

Bye bye vinyl! Welcome to the future.

Mind you, the CDJ1000 is very expensive!

more info: http://www.pioneerprodj.com/

[Disc0tek]

How about mixing mp3's? Has anyone here tried to go that route yet? I was thinking of buying PCDJ RED to play around with. Some people use Acid DJ also. Is it true that these programs can mix the songs flawlessly? I've used Mixmeister but it's a real pain to even line up the beats! Forget about doing it live!

[Masdefi]

Hi DJ Phil, your equipment seems to be what I would like to have, too! I have never seen that before, I am gonna find it on the Internet to know more. But anyway I cannot imagine how to beats with this "jog wheel"... I am an "old" vinyl DJ, and I need time to convert myself. If I have well understood, there are also two inputs for two turntables, that's interesting. Does the mixer has a good N/S ratio?
Anyway thank you for your reply, now it's more clear to me how to mix with CD's.

[Masdefi]

On 2002-04-29 20:06, nonkel808 wrote:
Yo Masdefi!

Nowadays theres also new way of mixin with CD's! The Pioneer CDJ-1000 !
This is an incredible Cd player, that can be handled like a Vinyl recordplayer!

Check out this movie where the DJ is scratching with a CDJ-1000! AMAZING
http://www.pioneerprodj.com/media/video/cdj1000.mov
Bye bye vinyl! Welcome to the future.

Mind you, the CDJ1000 is very expensive!

more info: http://www.pioneerprodj.com/products/cdj1000/cdj1000.mv

Wow, that's amazing! Hope in the future will be more cheap. But did you try it yet?

[Masdefi]

On 2002-04-29 18:58, DJ Phil wrote:
Numark 'CD Mix-1'

I can't find this model on the internet. Is it an old model? Could you write the exact model code?
Thanx

[nonkel808]

Wow, that's amazing! Hope in the future will be more cheap. But did you try it yet?

[/quote]

Yo Masdefi, i must say that i've never tried the CDJ-1000 myself, but I saw a demonstration at a festival last summer, and i've gor to say its pretty amazing, and it handles like real vinyl turntable. The guy did a house mix that really seemed flawless.
I would defenitely buy one to put next to my to turntables, if only it wasn't so expensive.

[DJ P]

Hello Masdefi, you'll find the CD-Mix 1 at the numark web site under 'system packages'(for some reason, it is not listed under cd players, I guess to them it's a 'system' because of the intergrated mixing board). Thier address is http://www.numark.com Hopes this info helps you

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: DJ Phil on 2002-05-01 08:06 ]</font>

[Giovanni]

I've been djing from 1979 to 1986 and left when when vinyl was THE thing and 1200s ruled. That's the reason why I love vinyl and vinyl mixing. But at that time already the firs samplers and synths began to appear in the dj booths. Every old school dj experimented almost everything with 1200s (blending, chop mixing, phasing, scratching, turntable drumming, etc...) and my knowledge of the technical skills of the art of vinyl djing is complete because I know what a dj is doing since I understand what a dj is doing. But when I see some dj CD mixing I am astonished since I cannot understand what he/she does because I don't know the Pioneer consolle. I tried the Pioneer of a dj friend some time ago and found that the game has different rules now!!!
I think that CD mixing gives the djs more technical opportunities. I recently saw a young dj (around 20 or so) making miracles with the Pioneers, sampling and remixing live every single track!!! And this is the way to dj today!!!

[Masdefi]

I don't know how CD mixing consolle works and I probably do not know at the moment how could be possible, for example, to let the entering song superpose the actual one on the same bpm. For example, the vinyl record is kept stopped while the turntable is turning and just at the first beat of the breakdown of the actual song I let the entering record superposing on the other. I wonder how this could be possible with CD if you do not "feel" it under your fingers.
Sorry, I'm so vinyl-man...
Hope to be clear, cheers

[DJ P]

Hi Masdefi, On 'CD' mixing (regardless of the player or brand), it takes 'practice' (in fact, alot of!!!!). I delt with vinly for years til cd's took over. Yes LP's are friends since the 'LP's' allowed us to achieve alot of 'special effects'. We could 'echo', 'rim' (or 'phase') or otherwise play with the mix and make are own. Without 'specs' or 'details on the mixers' the details. all that a buyer can rely on is the word from other users. I noticed in one of you earlier posts you asked about 'noise'. Well noise can result from a device, connection, cables or a combination of all. I myself, am hearing impaired. I have no problems in clubs (in fact I have a plus in that I have the ability to 'read lips' v.s. actually 'hearing' the said word). With the volume in clubs, the noise is definatly less noticable. At home, I 'crank' my system to be able to make out the 'cue' points on the vinly or cd to make the mix. Myself, I have never noticed any problems regarding 'noise' with the 'Numark' CD-1 mixing console. I have done several mixes on 'Discomusic.com' using the 'Numark'. If you heard them, it would give you an ideal of what the Numark can accomplish. All the best, DJ Phil (Phil)

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: DJ Phil on 2002-05-01 17:29 ]</font>

[NickNack]

Hi Masdefi,

I've had my Pioneer CDJ 500II CD players for quite a few years. I didn't replace my Technique 1200's but hooked them all up together. So, two turntables, to CD players, using a Stanton-Vestax mixing console. It's the best thing I've ever done with my system as I can have the best of both worlds.

Mixing with CD's does take time and like DJ Phil, I at first had a Numark. I believe it was their very first model and sadly, I should have waited because it had too many bugs in it. The Pioneers are excellent and that new 1000 model is awesome. I know I'll upgrade when the money is right.

You can treat the CDs like vinyl because the Pioneer has a "Pause", "Cue" and the "Jog Wheel". These three elements allow you to "hold and release" your CD just like you did the vinyl while the turntable was spinning. As far as noise and volume, the majority of CD's are pressed "hot" so I keep my line gain for the CD players lower than the turntable gains. This compensates for the lower pressing in the vinyl as the Master Volume rarely, if ever, needs to be changed.

CD players also offer a lot of effects you can't get from turntables: loops, samples, pitching with a "Master Lock" so that the vocals/instruments don't change tone. Pioneer also offers a mixing console made for the CDJ series giving you a lot of the above features plus auto BPM counting.

As far as MP3 mixing --- I've used PCDJ, Traktor by Native Instruments, Virtual Turntables and some others. Although I like the idea, I find this style of mixing VERY difficult if you're going to keep it in manual mode. All the controls are extremely sensitive. Now, if you're going to pre-program it and allow the software to "run your night", that's another thing. Depending on what you have, the software will do a simple "fade in/fade out" to actual beat-mixing with the parameters you choose to set (length of mix, volume shifts, etc.) This is nice but no fun, IMO. You're not really involved with what's going on. Hell, I wouldn't pay me to do this all night.

_________________
Dancin'... A Thing To Free Your Mind

Nicky

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: NickNack on 2002-05-01 20:56 ]</font>

[Masdefi]

On 2002-05-01 20:53, NickNack wrote:
Hi Masdefi,
I've had my Pioneer CDJ 500II CD players for quite a few years.
<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: NickNack on 2002-05-01 20:56 ]</font>

I went on the Pioneer web site and I found the CDj 500: is it only one player? or is it double player? has it the input jacks for two turntables? if it is just mono cd then $599 X 2.... :sad:

[Masdefi]

On 2002-05-01 17:25, DJ Phil wrote:
I have done several mixes on 'Discomusic.com' using the 'Numark'. If you heard them, it would give you an ideal of what the Numark can accomplish.

Thanks a lot Phil. Please let me know how to hear your mixes.
Masdefi

[Giovanni]

I went on the Pioneer web site and I found the CDj 500: is it only one player? or is it double player? has it the input jacks for two turntables? if it is just mono cd then $599 X 2.... :sad:

Pioneer CD players are the 1200s of today. They are expensive but worth the money. I payed about US $ 800 for my couple of 1200s back in 1981, and they are still perfect!!! It means US $ 40 per year. SO CHEAP!!!

[rhessel]

Hello:

About mixing MP3, I have been involved in this subject since last Tuesday.

I downloaded the ATOMIX MP3 FREE Version (demo), and it is unbelievable what can you do with it. It has BPM counter, even before playing the song, auto beat matching, auto pitch matching and reseting.

Download the demo version, try it and then tell how did you feel. I have no connection with the manufacturer.

The downloading site is http://www.atomixmp3.com/download.htm

and good mixes.

Hope to hear your comments about it.

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: rhessel on 2002-05-02 12:10 ]</font>

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: rhessel on 2002-05-02 12:11 ]</font>

[Masdefi]

On 2002-05-02 12:07, rhessel wrote:
The downloading site is http://www.atomixmp3.com/download.htm
Hope to hear your comments about it.

Hi rhessel,
I went on that site but the download page is not more available. Please check yourself if you can.
How big is the downloaded file? Maybe you can send me by email, but in this case I'll give you another address (bigger).

[NickNack]

On 2002-05-02 03:18, Masdefi wrote:

On 2002-05-01 20:53, NickNack wrote:
Hi Masdefi,
I've had my Pioneer CDJ 500II CD players for quite a few years.
<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: NickNack on 2002-05-01 20:56 ]</font>

I went on the Pioneer web site and I found the CDj 500: is it only one player? or is it double player? has it the input jacks for two turntables? if it is just mono cd then $599 X 2.... :sad:

Hi Masdefi,

The CDJ 500's are one player. They are not 'double deck' players like the Denon or the Numark. You should think of them as turntables, which means you would need two. The connect to your system the same way any turntable would but they do NOT go in the phono jack. You use your line or auxillary jacks. Believe me, they are worth the money.

[JussiK]

[/quote]

Pioneer CD players are the 1200s of today. They are expensive but worth the money[/quote]

People come on please! Nothing and I repeat nothing can ever take the place of 1200's - Amen. Mixing with cds...would you really be seen in public doing something as uncool as THAT!?