Did Mel Cheren Invent The Disco Instrumental "B" Side??

[remicks]

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he says he did ...

and tells about it in an illuminating story starting on page 118 of his autobiography .

Essentially it went down like this :

already knowing that DJ's were hungry for extended instrumental parts of songs with which to mix to make songs longer .... Mel saw his chance at Scepter when Ultra high Frequency had but one song to release as a single and nothing else for the flip side .

Mel suggested that the "B" side be the song's instrumental track.
(wide-eyed shocked face times five)
Unheard of !! never before !! we can't do that!! The public won't stand for it ....

"We can't do that Mel!! " Vice President Sam Goff at Scepter decreed, "People
will think we're trying to cheat them!!!"

Mel persisted until they caved in ( at this point Mel was getting more credo as Mel knows disco ) and they went ahead and released it as he insisted .

And so it happened that WE'RE ON THE RIGHT TRACK became the first single ever released with its instrumental track on the B side.The DJ's went wild ,and played the grooves out of the record...Within months the practice spread ,and by the end of 1973 the instrumental b-side began to play an enormous role in the development of the DJ's art. It became an industry standard ( moreso I wish ) and persists to this day

here then is the first instrumental B- side ever : (unless someone can name an earlier one ----Disco Funk (!) )




....god I love that .... Thank You Mel Cheren

.... I love disco !! ( cool smiley)



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[Disco Funk]

Thanks for the easy challenge, Remicks. I could go back further, but I don't really have to. Also from the City of Brotherly Love



There are quite a few from even earlier from philly, and other places too.

Disco Funk

[remicks]

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always so happy to hear that song!!! (cool smiley X 3) Disco Funk

BUT !
I believe that wonderful 45 came out in ....................1975 .........???



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[Disco Funk]

The Trammps released Zing b/w Penguin in 1972 on Buddah. Catalog # BDA 306, which is before their other two singles from that year.

But if you want to go even further back, still in philly, here's the vocal A side to the more famous B side. And it's from 1968, so there's no dispute there. :)

[remicks]

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Oh sometimes I hate you !!!!!! (cool smiley followed by evil smiley followed by frowning smiley)


OK I'm gonna make this work this way (tongue out) ... (I think )


This is the disco era's FIRST b side instrumental disco song :






( I think the Trammps recorded ZING and BIG APPLE in ' 72 but the single of them came out in '75 .....???)


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[remicks]

AND

I changed the thread's title a bit !!

--- added the narrowing word "disco"

(regular ol' smiley face)

[Disco Funk]

Sorry, Remicks, but it doesn't change the fact that Zing came out in '72, and thus making this the first disco single with an instrumental B side. If you're going by the Discogs entry, it's wrong. Just look at the catalog numbers for the follow-up singles, and you'll see they're higher than Zing's. There was also a clip of the old soul train from around '72 where everyone was dancing to Zing.

And then to add the final icing on the cake, you can see the info from the Trammps themselves in this link

http://www.thetrammps.net/19401.html

The Trammps' first recording, Zing Went the Strings Of My Heart, a remarkable remake of a tune originally recorded by Judy Garland in 1943, was recorded at the legendary Sigma Sound Studios in 1972 and was a bona fide chart hit, reaching #17 on the R&B chart and #64 on the pop charts that summer.

But it doesn't matter either way, it was still the MFSB guys playing on Zing and We're on The Right Track.

Disco Funk

[remicks]

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I concede ---- but only ((IF))) --- we want to label that song from (1972!!!) - "disco" .............

and I do ! (more smileys)

from: http://www.thetrammps.net/19401.html

The Trammps began in Philadelphia in 1972 featuring vocalist, Jimmy Ellis, Harold Doc Wade, Stanley Wade and Earl Young and traveled with as many as 11 members, culled from the ranks of the busiest and best musicians, many of whom also played for Gamble and Huff's Philly International and later for Vince Montana's Salsoul Orchestra. The Trammps' first recording, Zing Went the Strings Of My Heart, a remarkable remake of a tune originally recorded by Judy Garland in 1943, was recorded at the legendary Sigma Sound Studios in 1972 and was a bona fide chart hit, reaching #17 on the R&B chart and #64 on the pop charts that summer.

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[remicks]

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So I've been mulling this over the past 24 hours trying to figure out exactly where Mel Cheren was coming from ... and I think it comes to this :

It would seem , Mel was the first one to actually physically label the "B" side as "instrumental"...............(???)

Up until then there was a bit of game playing ... perhaps for royalty purposes or perhaps to mislead the buying public ... by giving the instrumental version its own title .
Thus in the two examples you cited Disco Funk -
the instrumental version of ZING WENT THE STRINGS OF MY HEART becomes PENGUIN IN THE BIG APPLE and the instrumental of Cliff Nobles' LOVE IS ALL RIGHT gets named THE HORSE .

To be sure - with this method , the buying public had no idea what exactly they were getting as the b-side.

This is where Mel's twist to the proposition is so significant.... unlike Scepters Sam Goff who thought the buyer would feel he was being "cheated" when noticing he was getting the a-side's instrumental version as the b-side , Mel was certain that by informing the buyers of such ..... disco DJs specifically..... this bonus of the instrumental version (on dance-oriented records ) -- would actually increase sales .

That I think is monumental in the disco story because it made releasing instrumental versions acceptable ... even desirable ... and as Mel says this provided one more tool for developing DJ styles and from there , the rest is disco history.... (cool smiley)

That's my latest thought on it and of course DF ( and all others) I welcome your input about it:

-the new question then is -

Is
WE'RE ON THE RIGHT TRACK the first 7" to specifically label its b- side thus:
WE'RE ON THE RIGHT TRACK (instrumental) ..............?????


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[Disco Funk]

The Fuzz did a track called I Love You For All Seasons, and the flip side is the song titled and instrumental added to it. It's a mid tempo love song. There are others with 'instrumental' listed as the flip, you'll need to give me a chance to dig it up. :)

Disco Funk

[remicks]

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DC LaRue discusses the importance of this instrumental "b" side in shaping disco music.




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[Disco Funk]

Thank you for that video. I knew that stuff, but it's interesting hearing it coming from someone who lived it!

By the way, there were a bunch of 45s on Ric Tic in the 60s by The Flaming Ember that had instrumental B sides. This was one of them, the instrumental mix to the Flaming Ember's She's A Real Live Wire.



Disco Funk

[DISCODISK]

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Essentially it went down like this :

already knowing that DJ's were hungry for extended instrumental parts of songs with which to mix to make songs longer .... Mel saw his chance at Scepter when Ultra high Frequency had but one song to release as a single and nothing else for the flip side .

Mel suggested that the "B" side be the song's instrumental track.
(wide-eyed shocked face times five)
Unheard of !! never before !! we can't do that!! The public won't stand for it ....

"We can't do that Mel!! " Vice President Sam Goff at Scepter decreed, "People
will think we're trying to cheat them!!!"

SAM GOFF decreed people will think we are trying to cheat them!,
there will be riots in the streets, citys will burn!!!!![ i made this bit up!]
he must have a short memory because only 7 releases prior to Ultra high Frequency
he released this vocal /instrumental....
boo on you.jpg
im not believing mel..

[remicks]

he must have a short memory because only 7 releases prior to Ultra high Frequency
he released this vocal /instrumental....
boo on you.jpg
im not believing mel..

Mel's point was to purposely market an instrumental side & label it as such .... that such was a dance music selling point .... DJ's at this point were seeking that .

Goff was balking at that idea :The traditional trick when labels were releasing a "b" side instrumental was to mask it so that it wasn't apparent

which is what Wand did with BOO ON YOU

calling its "b" side - which was apparently an instrumental version of the "a" side (but who can tell) - : "BOOTIES".

Disco Funk:

By the way, there were a bunch of 45s on Ric Tic in the 60s by The Flaming Ember that had instrumental B sides. This was one of them, the instrumental mix to the Flaming Ember's She's A Real Live Wire. Disco Funk

Same response as above.

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[discokicks]

One record that comes to mind that does have an instrumental side (and labelled that way) is Dave and Ansil Collins' Double Barrel from 1971. I was going to look for my 45 copy in the basement but then I did an internet search and found this...
http://www.discomusic.com/records-more/13756_0_2_0_C/

I still love this tune! (cool amateur video too)

[DISCODISK]

[QUOTE=remicks;177294]Mel's point was to purposely market an instrumental side & label it as such .... that such was a dance music selling point .... DJ's at this point were seeking that .

Goff was balking at that idea :The traditional trick when labels were releasing a "b" side instrumental was to mask it so that it wasn't apparent







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[QUOTE]

no Goff wasnt balking at all, it wasnt new to wand they were doing it in the late 60s eg AL Wilson help me is clearly labelled instrumental on the b.side, im not saying this never happened but if so it wasnt quite like its told in that story!