Opinion: Is Jean Carne's, Was That All It Was, A Disco Classic?

[Dayna]

In the DiscoMusic.com Record Vaults There's a question raised by an ex member as to if "Was That All It Was" by Jean Carne is a Disco Classic ,he say's no..:icon_eek:..I say Hell YES..It's #4 on my top 50 favorite Disco songs of all time .Everything about it speaks to me.If you have ever heard it on a Fierce sound system it can be a religious experience..What's you're opinion on this subject ?..I'm an inquiring mind.
There's also a statement about the 1989/1990 version covered by Kym Mayzelle saying it's forgettable
and there are commenter's coming to Kym's defense basically saying how fabulous it is..
I think Kym is talented but she aint no Jean Carne and certainly no Candi Staton for that matter, seeing as she also covered
Young Hearts..
Here are both versions Jean's and Kym's ..

[kdavid13]

Oh I also love this one,too. Pure heaven - listening to this track.I remember finding a used copy of the Philadelphia International 12" (silver & black label) and it was a blessing.

Miss Carn truly shines on this soulful track.I liked Kym's remake but mainly because I was such a fan of the original.

[Disco Funk]

A really great song, definitely a disco dancefloor classic. Maybe the slower tempo is a put off for some people. It's a prime example of the change in the Philly Sound that occurred in the late 70s. The guy who arranged it and co-wrote it was John Usry, who before coming to Philadelphia was the man behind the Stratavarious project in Canada.

I also like the flip side What's On Your Mind. It's really a nice funky disco groove, reminiscent of Gloria Gaynor's Anybody Wanna Party, but at a faster tempo.

Disco Funk

[paul]

Well, I hate to break up the lovefest but it was an ok disco song for me. It wouldn't make my classic choices. Sorry :icon_cool:

[SandraDee]

I do love it as it's got such a classy sound (that's why Kym Mazelle's version, or any other version for that matter, couldn't ever better it 'cos production standards were at their peak in the late 70s/early 80s) - a new sound was starting in '79, a new r'n'b/dance sound that really took off in the early 80s that's now called 'boogie' which this track is very much an example of. Other examples would be 'Whatch Gonna Do With My Lovin' by Stephanie Mills, ''It Must Be Love' by Alton Mclain & Destiny, & 'Get Down' by Gene Chandler to name a few off the top of my head. This sound signalled an end (if only temporarily) of frantic euro disco & a return to disco's black funky roots in a way, but with a new disco glossy sheen. I really do feel that WTAIW IS a classic. (in fact the whole LP that it came from is a classic IMO).

[the disco kid]

Classic morning music, brilliant lyrics, perfect for the end of the night.

[markydefad]

I agree with all here who love it!!! It would be in my Top 10--maybe Top 5 of alltime. Just a perfect melding of vocal, music and minor chord moody mood---the "was that all it was?" indignant bitterness after being dumped is powerfully expressed in the sharp lyrics and Jean's powerful vocal. This is her peak performance, IMHO ...co-produced and co-writen by the legendary Jerry Butler--this shoulda been a bigger hit. :icon_evil:

No Pop #100 charting ever for any Jean Carn record!

R&B charted as the b-side of "My Love Don't Come Easy" which peaked @ #43. :icon_eek:

Even the Disco chart only moved it as high as #22--but at Trocadero in SF it was a #1 fave for a long, long time as it remained a staple of the morning music programs--one of the beloved tunes that people screamed for when it was played.

At 5:00 am on a Sunday morning, after having danced the night away, the emotions Jean expressed were deeply felt by, I would venture to say, nearly every gay man dancing. "Was that all it was?"..."a momentary thing (fling?)/ not worth remembering in the morning"---everybody had a person in their past who'd done them wrong. This was the song that expressed it perfectly and in a classy way--but Jean was still pissed. It was cathartic.

It should also be mentioned that if you've only heard the short LP version--you haven't really heard the record. The 6:30 [actually when timed it's really 7:44!] 12" mix just expands it to greatness--whenever I bought a Jean Carn CD compilation I was so disappointed that they always included the short version. Every time! Such a disservice to a brilliant record--one of the best from PIR and that's saying a lot!

[Disco Funk]

Here are a few other PIR tracks that John Usry also produced. They all have that same nice feel that the Jean Carn track has Disco Funk

[SandraDee]

Only last week I was watching a TV tribute to Curtis Mayfield, & Jerry Butler was interviewed & he seems such a nice, down-to-earth person.

[tmob]

I'm in with just about everyone else here. I think "Was That All it Was" is one of those neglected Philly classics (e.g., City Limits' "Love is Everywhere," Jerry Butler's "Cooling Out," the Jones Girls "Nights Over Egypt"). Carn pulled out all the stops on this one, and nailed it. It's hard to imagine anyone who could have conveyed the sense of bitterness and longing better.

By the way, Jerry Butler is one of our County Commissioners here in Chicago. He still makes appearances at oldies shows every so often...

[SandraDee]

the Jones Girls "Nights Over Egypt

OMG! Now that track is definitely in my top 10 of all time, regardless of genre, along with 'Mysteries Of The World' by MFSB (Dexter Wansell is so under-rated IMO). The sound on those tracks is completely magical & unique & I could listen to them for eternity if I lived that long.

[Dayna]

I agree with all here who love it!!! It would be in my Top 10--maybe Top 5 of alltime. Just a perfect melding of vocal, music and minor chord moody mood---the "was that all it was?" indignant bitterness after being dumped is powerfully expressed in the sharp lyrics and Jean's powerful vocal. This is her peak performance, IMHO ...co-produced and co-writen by the legendary Jerry Butler--this shoulda been a bigger hit. :icon_evil:

I KNOW THAT'S RIGHT~!!
It's a brilliant song

[thommy2458]

This is one of those songs that did get bigger as time went on.I remember
going to a record store in the Castro while in San Francisco in 1983.They were playing the usual stuff that was out at the time,but then the guy behind the counter working the turntables slipped this on and there was a
loud audible "Ahhhhh" and "I love this song" within the packed store.
I think at the time it was released,the problem may have been the BPM's-there was alot of Italian Eurodisco that was faster.But DJ's not afraid to play slower down tempo tracks had no problem finding a place for it. A true sign of a classic is how it ages,and this one is like a beautiful
bottle of French wine-subtle with sweet,intense flavors.

Thom

[PierreConstantin]

On my top 5, a brilliant song and a rare example of meaningful lyrics mixing perfectly with the music; the couple voice/bass is another winner here; but in her time (the very beginning of the year 1980) it wasn't the classic it became. Maybe PIR itself wasn't sure of the potential of the song, which is the last on the album: record companies seldom put a song they consider a hit at the end of an album.

Mazelle's version? Come on! The background synth track of her cover is truly awful. I prefer 1985 Debbie Rose's cover -even if Carn's version is actually incomparable.

There's a problem with Carn's 12": some pressings have the 7:44 mix [and the extended "What's on your mind" 5:45 on the B-side] but other have the 6:30 mix. The 6:30 version is quite common: it was also re-released on vinyl in 1987 (in the Mixed masters series) and on cd's like "Philadelphia uncovered". A 2-cd pack compiling PIR 12"s was released in 2006 par Demon (UK): the version here is the 6:30 even if it says 7:44 on the back.
I have the full-length 7:44 version on the Import US 12" I bought in July 1980 (the silver and black starry jacket) but it says 6:30 in the center of the vinyl! [The B-side is still "What's on your mind" 5:45.] I saw this same US 12" in a record shop a few months ago so I said to the dealer that the timing indication was a misprint. But, when we checked out the timing listening to the full record, the watch said 6:30! Apparently, two pressings are available and there is no way to know which is was.
A more or less similar story happens with "Strut your funky stuff" by Frantique, another PIR disco classic. Two versions are available on 12"s : 5:45 and 6:15. But in this case it's easier because US pressings have the longer version (but not all European 12"s have the shorter one; any way there is no misprint on the record).

[KBallenger53]

I'm with you on The Original Dayna!!!:icon_cool: And coming from a DJ's Perspective, it's also a Great Record to Mix with. Goes excellent with T-Connection's: AT MIDNITE!!! Especially if you Blend in the beginning of it, with the breakdown in "Was That All It Was"!!!

DELICIOUS!!!:icon_mrgreen:

'NUFF SAID

[VINYLLIFE]

I too agree that this is a top 10 Disco cut. I also agree that it is better now than ever. When the Euro Nrg sound dominated Disco I did not even attempt to give this song a shot. Every Hustle event we do seems to include this record. Our dancers never tire of this tune. Puts the "floating on clouds" mood in everybody.Hey KBallenger53 thanks for the mix tip, I'll try it out like you said....then before the vocals kick in......go into Jingo!!! Jingo bop!!...huwaaaa!!
Check out a clip from this Saturday's event.
YouTube - Mark Starr Celebrates his birthday by dancing hustle with his friends near Los Angeles

[Svend]

I didn't know from Jean Carn in the 1970s. When I first heard "Was That All It Was" on one of those Best Disco Album in the World collections--it was instant, utter love. Gorgeous song lyrically, instrumentally and vocally. I searched high and low until I found the long version on CD. Je t'adore Jean Carn! Thank you, Dayna, for shining the spotlight on this gifted woman and a great song.

Did people like the Hannah Jones cover with a sample from Saturday Night Band's "Come On Dance, Dance"? Thought it had some merit but was generally too frantic.

And I want to put in a good word for my other fave Jean Carn track, "Free Love"!

[markydefad]

There's a problem with Carn's 12": some pressings have the 7:44 mix [and the extended "What's on your mind" 5:45 on the B-side] but other have the 6:30 mix. The 6:30 version is quite common: it was also re-released on vinyl in 1987 (in the Mixed masters series) and on cd's like "Philadelphia uncovered". A 2-cd pack compiling PIR 12"s was released in 2006 par Demon (UK): the version here is the 6:30 even if it says 7:44 on the back.
I have the full-length 7:44 version on the Import US 12" I bought in July 1980 (the silver and black starry jacket) but it says 6:30 in the center of the vinyl! [The B-side is still "What's on your mind" 5:45.] I saw this same US 12" in a record shop a few months ago so I said to the dealer that the timing indication was a misprint. But, when we checked out the timing listening to the full record, the watch said 6:30! Apparently, two pressings are available and there is no way to know which is was.

This is most interesting. My 1979 12" U.S. commercial release copy says 6:30--but when I listened to the Youtube clip--which times at just under 8:00 (maybe because clips are shown before the song starts)--it sounds the same as what I have. I must time my 12" to check this tonight --- never realized there was a timing issue on this record! Thanks for the info.

[Update: yes, my 12" is the 7:45 one mislabed 6:30... just did a timing.]

[RetroRuss]

Definitely a classic!

[ashley_k]

US 12" - SHOT OUT - Jean Carn "Was That All It Was"

As I have the a demo 12" and a commercial 12" I've recorded them both in and compared them and found the following:

White Label Demo/Promo - AS 735 (XSS 167117)
Time: 6.30 - (this 12" is also approx 1.5 bpm slower that the commercial 12")

Silver and Black Commercial - 4Z8 3103 (AA-AF 4Z8 3103-3)
Time: 7.45 - (this 12" is also approx 1.5 bpm faster that the demo 12")

So it looks like they sped up some (or all) of the commercial 12"s a tiny bit and made them longer by fading them out later on, I don't know if any 6.30 commercial 12"s exist.


ooh and "Was That All It Was" is a classic!

[PierreConstantin]

There's also a statement about the 1989/1990 version covered by Kym Mayzelle saying it's forgettable

Having the album "Crazy", I've listened to it and ouch! it's not that good and they are many times when Mazelle is not at her best (to say the least). First of all the end of the 80's wasn't the best time for music and the mechanichal synth sound hasn't aged well. But on several songs, "Was That All It Was" being one of those, Mazelle can't keep the melodic line and she sings awfully off key! Apparently she was having serious technique issues. Nevertheless, at the time, many people (including me) considered that she was "the diva of the future", a real hope in the world of dance music but now I understand why she released only one album in her career ("Brilliant" and "Crazy" are basically the same and her 2004 one, "The Pleasure Is Mine", is an ambiguous opus made of covers of her previous hits). The singles she released circa 1992-1996 were in comparison much better, like "Love me the right way", "Searching for the golden eye', "Young hearts run free"... even if sometimes her singing is quite "inelegant" (to put it mildly).

Anyway she shouldn't have covered "Was That All It Was" and Marshall Jefferson and David Morales shouldn't have produced it that way.
Hannah Jones did a better job in 1999 but Jean Carn's original version definitely can't be improved. :icon_smile:

[KBallenger53]

I too agree that this is a top 10 Disco cut. I also agree that it is better now than ever. When the Euro Nrg sound dominated Disco I did not even attempt to give this song a shot. Every Hustle event we do seems to include this record. Our dancers never tire of this tune. Puts the "floating on clouds" mood in everybody.Hey KBallenger53 thanks for the mix tip, I'll try it out like you said....then before the vocals kick in......go into Jingo!!! Jingo bop!!...huwaaaa!!
Check out a clip from this Saturday's event.
YouTube - Mark Starr Celebrates his birthday by dancing hustle with his friends near Los Angeles

Hey, no problem Vinyllife!!! Just make sure you don't give nobody a Heart Attack!!!:icon_lol:

"OH, THIS IS THE BIG ONE! YOU HEAR THAT ELIZABETH, I'M COMIN' TO JOIN YA HONEY!!! WITH 2 RECORDS IN MY HANDS!!!

'NUFF SAID

[remicks]

****

Well, besides being one of those smooth lilting disco songs that just commanded you to glide across the dancefloor .......

Its got Jean's remarkable once-in-a-career vocal interpretation with her emotion-drenched soft cooing ad libs ....a playful bass line , the sneak-up-behind-you sting arrangement:

only to be followed by the warning drum roll:


... which is followed by those maximized , hard-hitting, right-in -the-gut, horn punches

mirroring that same gut-wrenching feeling ones gets when descending from a place of hope & love with the sobbering stark realization of :


......... " was that all it was ? " ---- BAM !!!! :icon_cry::icon_sad::icon_cry:




*****

[markydefad]

When I've played WTAIW recently I've been very aware of the trombones hitting that very long low note that seems to anchor it into a down, sad, bitter-sweet place. Anyone else notice the trombones??? :icon_question::icon_confused::icon_question:

[remicks]

When I've played WTAIW recently I've been very aware of the trombones hitting that very long low note that seems to anchor it into a down, sad, bitter-sweet place. Anyone else notice the trombones??? :icon_question::icon_confused::icon_question:

Yes you're right .That long reflective , cause for pause trombone note ..... another vital component to the collective feel of this.


What a masterpiece. :icon_cool:


*****