Don Ray..Is he given enough credit?

[Dayna]

Don Ray
Has contributed many gifts to Disco music besides his "Garden Of Love" LP..He has lent his Talented attributes to many other wonderful Disco collaborations
Including Santa Esmeralda,Cerrone,Alec R Costandino's Ect, as if that wouldnt be enough..
Do you think he is given the credit he deserves or do you think he is over shawdowed due to the company he is accociated with ?
I personally think he is under rated:icon_confused:
I heard the record below and Loved it, It gave me chills~!

SPHINX "SIMON PETER" 12" RARE DON RAY FRENCH DISCO FUNK

There is a sample of the song on the page below
SPHINX "SIMON PETER" 12" RARE DON RAY FRENCH DISCO FUNK - eBay (item 380001199677 end time Mar-06-08 14:46:02 PST)

[ashley]

.. hello Dayna .. I love a lot of French 70s disco .. and the name Don Ray appears often .. he seems to have arranged & orchestrated all the early Costandinos & Cerrone projects .. I wonder where he is now ??
.. pure genius
:icon_cool:

[VINYLLIFE]

Hello Dayna
I agree...more credit and recognition is due!!!
Just last night I was dusting off some 7" Disco singles and giving them a spin. In another room of my house was my 17 yr old son and his friend practicing some of their METAL MUSIC..DEEP VERY DARK, METAL MUSIC:icon_twisted:. When the boys came out of their room to get a ride home, I was spinning Don Ray's Standing in the rain. My sons friend commented on the song and asked me to play it again. I asked him to sit down. I played the 12" version for him. I've always known how Don Ray's magic touched my inner music soul, it was cool to see anothers inner also touched.Goes to show the power of Don Ray. Made me relize how fortunate my 2 boys are to have literally been raised on Real Disco music. They are both heavily into music, one punk ,one metal, both having a solid foundation of Real Disco roots. Thank you to Don Ray and all the other important talented musicians of the 70's.

[QUINNY]

I think he just about gets the regognition he deserves. He obviously has a lotta cred on a site such as this, but the general public probably wouldn't know him from Adam.
Considering most of his 'hits' were somewhat underground, that's about right.

[Dayna]

.. hello Dayna .. I love a lot of French 70s disco .. and the name Don Ray appears often .. he seems to have arranged & orchestrated all the early Costandinos & Cerrone projects .. I wonder where he is now ??
.. pure genius
:icon_cool:

Hi Ashley,
As far as I know he is still alive and well living in Paris
That's the last update I had..

[SandraDee]

Don Ray's definitely under-rated. An example of this is an LP from '79 that I absolutely love by Michele Freeman which Don Ray wrote, arranged & produced but it seems largely forgotten now but I consider it to be disco perfection.:icon_razz:

[STEPHEN L FREEMAN]

]I heard the record below and Loved it, It gave me chills~![/I][/B][/SIZE][/FONT]
SPHINX "SIMON PETER" 12" RARE DON RAY FRENCH DISCO FUNK

I'd imagine that, if you've never heard "Simon Peter", all the way through... Then you've also not been amazed by the absolute perfection of that LP's other track, "Judas Iscariot". To me, it is Alec's greatest accomplishment in his style of modern-classical symphonic-storytelling. And it's the recording he did, immediately following the 1st "Love & Kisses" LP. Followed by "Sumeria", which was a bit more "out there". Then reeling-it-in for a more marketable formula (and unquestionably succeeding...) with "Romeo & Juliet". Now... Back to Don Ray.

I have a few LPs that Don Ray did arrangements on, prior to Alec & Cerrone, etc... For instance, the LP "Disco" by Claude Francois. Wherein the arrangements are done by none other than J.C. Petit, Ray Jimenez, Ray Donnez (Don Ray) and Slim Pezin (Voyage, Sumeria, Symphonie Spatiale). AND... Not one track could be considered as of the French Disco Sound that we relate to Alec and Cerrone, etc... They all have a much more disco-pop feel to them. Notably, as well, J.C. Petit arranged almost, if not all of Alec's solo singles from '69, '70... At least all the ones I have. (But I am closing-in on the complete Alec, pre-disco, solo collection.) Yet, aside from some trademark string runs, there's absolutely no indication of what was to come in '76. Although, the Khnenetsky arranged and Alec composed LP, "Saturn EA" did hint at the synthesizer elements that were to become staple parts of the French Disco sound, this LP was also a '77 release, but prior to Love & Kisses, and in no way, near the same vein. I doubt Alec produce it, but can't be sure, since there's no producer credited. But, as far as Khnenetsky's arrangements are concerned, the 1st track is, conceptually, VERY similar to the "Landsdowne" and "Trident" Suites, from Paris Connection.

Although the most infamous LPs state they're arranged by Don Ray, remember that he is, primarily, a string & horn arranger. He, along with J.C. Petit, R. Khnenetsky and R. Jimenez were orchestrally duplicating a "sound" created by Alec. As well as imitating eachother. Hence, the insane similarity between Don Ray's arrangement of "House of The Rising Sun", and J. C. Petit' arrangement of the same, for Santa Esmerelda. (Oh yeah... The reason Don Ray didn't arrange the 2nd Santa Esmeralda LP, in the summer of '77, is because he was too busy with "Sumeria", the "Supernature" LP and "Romeo & Juliet", ALL at the same time. No other reason. Believe no rumours to the contrary.) And, for the record, Don Ray's production is simply better than J.C. Petit's. J.C. Petit was, obviously, brought in to knock-off the arrangement on the previous hit "Don't Let Me Be Misunderstood". (Anyone knows that it was the latin-french disco fusion arrangement, not necessarily the vocals, that made that a world-wide hit) And he did so, perfectly! But Don Ray's horns, strings and percussion were more original in his interpretation for Revelation, at he end of that same year. Even if the track was, essentially the same. Honestly, Santa Esmerelda's version tanked. And Cerrone jumped on the idea, by backing another production, with Don Ray. Wherein he showed that he's better at doing "Don Ray", than anyone else. No great drama here. Just the music business, as usual. Lastly, L. Rich's vocals (backed by the birds of paris) are simply better than Jimmy Goings'.

It wasn't until after he combined his take on his & Alec's "French Disco Sound" with the writings of Lene Lovich, for Cerrone's "Supernature", that Don found his own groove. (Listen to "Standing in The Rain", then listen to "Supernature". Then listen to "Je Suis Music", then listen to Don's production of Michelle Freeman's "Tumble Heat". There's no questioning their similarities in the use of strings and horns. Don Ray's strings and horns are almost easily identifiable, without reading the label.)

J.C. Petit was a much broader arranger than Don Ray. For no other reason than decades of experience. Compare the 1st Love & Kisses LP, to the 2nd. L&K #2's got a hell-uv-a lot more going on. (I'm NOT saying one's better than the other! Just technical notations here...) And who else could put a banjo out front on a disco mix and have it be momentary perfection???!!! (Listen the the vocal fills: "Love you like nobody's loved you. Kiss you like nobody's kissed you.", about 3/4 of the way through "How Much, How Much..." and you'll hear what I'm talking about.) Santa Esmerelda's "Another Cha Cha" could never have been the wall-of-sound that it was, if anyone but J.C. Petit had arranged it.

In some cases, like Alec, the arranger adds his talents to the Producer's work. And in others like Cerrone or, Bob Esty on Donna's "Once Upon A Time", the arranger does pretty-much all the work. I LOVE arrangers. I've bought records based, solely, upon who the arranger was, without hearing them first. I've studied and examined these Men's work throughout the decades. Even sitting down and comparing tracks between arrangers, to find the subtle differences. And "NO"... None of them get enough credit. Not Don Ray, J.C. Petit, R.T. Khnenetsky, R. Jimenez, Thor Baldursson (IMHO The greatest and most versatile of them all!), Jean-Luc Drion, Rainer Pietsch... And the list goes on..

[Videoskooter]

Hi Ashley,
As far as I know he is still alive and well living in Paris
That's the last update I had..

Yes, Raymond Donnez, who is in fact from German origin is still alive and more, he's still working (f.i. Cerrone's "Hysteria" album) But he has done so much more in his career so that's why he was rewarded with the "Oscar De La Chanson Française" and really, they give that only to people who really meant something for the world of music. The BIG shots in the French Music Biz!

This is some stuff by him outside Discoland:

Encyclopédisque - Discographie : Raymond DONNEZ (Arrangeur)

And this is for Stephen:





And this is for Dayna:

[SandraDee]

Alec C & co are fantastic aren't they? One minute creating the lewd & porno-fantastic Love In C Minor & the next making this biblical disco epic. How can that be beaten?:icon_razz::icon_cool:

[Dayna]

I'd imagine that, if you've never heard "Simon Peter", all the way through... Then you've also not been amazed by the absolute perfection of that LP's other track, "Judas Iscariot". To me, it is Alec's greatest accomplishment in his style of modern-classical symphonic-storytelling. And it's the recording he did, immediately following the 1st "Love & Kisses" LP. Followed by "Sumeria", which was a bit more "out there". Then reeling-it-in for a more marketable formula (and unquestionably succeeding...) with "Romeo & Juliet". Now... Back to Don Ray.

I have a few LPs that Don Ray did arrangements on, prior to Alec & Cerrone, etc... For instance, the LP "Disco" by Claude Francois. Wherein the arrangements are done by none other than J.C. Petit, Ray Jimenez, Ray Donnez (Don Ray) and Slim Pezin (Voyage, Sumeria, Symphonie Spatiale). AND... Not one track could be considered as of the French Disco Sound that we relate to Alec and Cerrone, etc... They all have a much more disco-pop feel to them. Notably, as well, J.C. Petit arranged almost, if not all of Alec's solo singles from '69, '70... At least all the ones I have. (But I am closing-in on the complete Alec, pre-disco, solo collection.) Yet, aside from some trademark string runs, there's absolutely no indication of what was to come in '76. Although, the Khnenetsky arranged and Alec composed LP, "Saturn EA" did hint at the synthesizer elements that were to become staple parts of the French Disco sound, this LP was also a '77 release, but prior to Love & Kisses, and in no way, near the same vein. I doubt Alec produce it, but can't be sure, since there's no producer credited. But, as far as Khnenetsky's arrangements are concerned, the 1st track is, conceptually, VERY similar to the "Landsdowne" and "Trident" Suites, from Paris Connection.

Although the most infamous LPs state they're arranged by Don Ray, remember that he is, primarily, a string & horn arranger. He, along with J.C. Petit, R. Khnenetsky and R. Jimenez were orchestrally duplicating a "sound" created by Alec. As well as imitating eachother. Hence, the insane similarity between Don Ray's arrangement of "House of The Rising Sun", and J. C. Petit' arrangement of the same, for Santa Esmerelda. (Oh yeah... The reason Don Ray didn't arrange the 2nd Santa Esmeralda LP, in the summer of '77, is because he was too busy with "Sumeria", the "Supernature" LP and "Romeo & Juliet", ALL at the same time. No other reason. Believe no rumours to the contrary.) And, for the record, Don Ray's production is simply better than J.C. Petit's. J.C. Petit was, obviously, brought in to knock-off the arrangement on the previous hit "Don't Let Me Be Misunderstood". (Anyone knows that it was the latin-french disco fusion arrangement, not necessarily the vocals, that made that a world-wide hit) And he did so, perfectly! But Don Ray's horns, strings and percussion were more original in his interpretation for Revelation, at he end of that same year. Even if the track was, essentially the same. Honestly, Santa Esmerelda's version tanked. And Cerrone jumped on the idea, by backing another production, with Don Ray. Wherein he showed that he's better at doing "Don Ray", than anyone else. No great drama here. Just the music business, as usual. Lastly, L. Rich's vocals (backed by the birds of paris) are simply better than Jimmy Goings'.

It wasn't until after he combined his take on his & Alec's "French Disco Sound" with the writings of Lene Lovich, for Cerrone's "Supernature", that Don found his own groove. (Listen to "Standing in The Rain", then listen to "Supernature". Then listen to "Je Suis Music", then listen to Don's production of Michelle Freeman's "Tumble Heat". There's no questioning their similarities in the use of strings and horns. Don Ray's strings and horns are almost easily identifiable, without reading the label.)

J.C. Petit was a much broader arranger than Don Ray. For no other reason than decades of experience. Compare the 1st Love & Kisses LP, to the 2nd. L&K #2's got a hell-uv-a lot more going on. (I'm NOT saying one's better than the other! Just technical notations here...) And who else could put a banjo out front on a disco mix and have it be momentary perfection???!!! (Listen the the vocal fills: "Love you like nobody's loved you. Kiss you like nobody's kissed you.", about 3/4 of the way through "How Much, How Much..." and you'll hear what I'm talking about.) Santa Esmerelda's "Another Cha Cha" could never have been the wall-of-sound that it was, if anyone but J.C. Petit had arranged it.

In some cases, like Alec, the arranger adds his talents to the Producer's work. And in others like Cerrone or, Bob Esty on Donna's "Once Upon A Time", the arranger does pretty-much all the work. I LOVE arrangers. I've bought records based, solely, upon who the arranger was, without hearing them first. I've studied and examined these Men's work throughout the decades. Even sitting down and comparing tracks between arrangers, to find the subtle differences. And "NO"... None of them get enough credit. Not Don Ray, J.C. Petit, R.T. Khnenetsky, R. Jimenez, Thor Baldursson (IMHO The greatest and most versatile of them all!), Jean-Luc Drion, Rainer Pietsch... And the list goes on..

Stephen
Your Knowledge astounds me~!!
Thank you for your indepth insight..........xoxo

[thommy2458]

Stephen-I completely forgot that Lene Lovich was a link
to Cerrone and Don Ray-I LOVE her.She sang back up before going solo on both of their stuff, right? I wonder
what happened to her.
I can remember when the Sphinx LP was released and it was a French import-I couldn't come up with cash on
my measly fast food wages,But my friend bought it before me and I was green with envy.It sounded so exotic
and dangerous(to a nice Catholic boy)

Thom

[Dayna]

Yes, Raymond Donnez, who is in fact from German origin is still alive and more, he's still working (f.i. Cerrone's "Hysteria" album) But he has done so much more in his career so that's why he was rewarded with the "Oscar De La Chanson Française" and really, they give that only to people who really meant something for the world of music. The BIG shots in the French Music Biz!

This is some stuff by him outside Discoland:

Encyclopédisque - Discographie : Raymond DONNEZ (Arrangeur)

And this is for Dayna:

Thank you sweetie........
LOVEEEEEE ITTTTTTTT:icon_biggrin:
xoxo

[SandraDee]

I wonder
what happened to her.

Lene Lovich was on TV last week interviewed as part of the documentary about the Stiff record company. She looked OK & just as eccentric as ever!

[STEPHEN L FREEMAN]

Stephen-I completely forgot that Lene Lovich was a link
to Cerrone and Don Ray-I LOVE her.She sang back up before going solo on both of their stuff, right? I wonder
what happened to her.
I can remember when the Sphinx LP was released and it was a French import-I couldn't come up with cash on
my measly fast food wages,But my friend bought it before me and I was green with envy.It sounded so exotic
and dangerous(to a nice Catholic boy)

Thom

I don't know about her singing on anything of Cerrone's. But it has come to light, (thankfully, after these many years) that she wrote the entire "Cerrone's Paradise", "SuperNature" and "Je Suis Music" LPs, with Alain Wisniak, for Cerrone. For the "Angelina" LP she was replaced by Bill Bowersock, as lyricist.

I used to play "Judas", every Easter Sunday T-Dance.:icon_twisted: Just waiting for the skies to open and be struck by lightning.
When it came out I bought 2 copies and only broke the seal on the 2nd copy this past year. If you got a first press french-RAAL copy, it has a sticker that says "French Disco - From THE CREATOR of the Cerrone/Love & Kisses Sound". That sticker got yanked fairly fast.:icon_lol:

Lastly, F.Y.I. - Love & Kisses(1), Sphinx and Sumeria are the only LPs where Casablanca's mastering/pressings equaled the quality of the Euro pressings. (Even "Romeo & Juliet" pales in comparison to the French "IBIS" pressing, And if you can get a Japanese "PHILLIPS" copy of R&J, DO IT! It's a freakin' religious experience!!!)

[Marcio**]

Hi,
In an interview from 2006, Cerrone himself showed his method of work and his fellings about Don Ray's The Garden Of Love (curiously on Polydor label): it's still my baby !!!
Beatz By The Pound » Interview: Cerrone




''If I made a production or a track for someone else, like Don Ray or Kongas or something like that, it’s still 75% myself, so, it’s still my baby! For example, for my last LP I composed 18 songs, and I know that I’m only going to use 12 or 14 songs for the record, so the other four songs are maybe going to go to someone else, but… I’m going to do something with it. Like, the Don Ray album—I had too many tracks for my album Supernature, and in the meantime, because Don Ray was my arranger for strings and brass, I said let’s make an LP for you—and we finished the LP together, but as I said, these are still my songs, my production—my babies!''
Disco producer Cerrone/2006

[Videoskooter]

Cool track for the sunny dayZ

[STEPHEN L FREEMAN]

just stumbled across this...

Hi,
In an interview from 2006, Cerrone himself showed his method of work and his fellings about Don Ray's The Garden Of Love
(curiously on Polydor label): it's still my baby !!!
Beatz By The Pound » Interview: Cerrone

''If I made a production or a track for someone else, like Don Ray or Kongas or something like that, it’s still 75% myself, so, it’s still my baby! For example, for my last LP I composed 18 songs, and I know that I’m only going to use 12 or 14 songs for the record, so the other four songs are maybe going to go to someone else, but… I’m going to do something with it. Like, the Don Ray album—I had too many tracks for my album Supernature, and in the meantime, because Don Ray was my arranger for strings and brass, I said let’s make an LP for you—and we finished the LP together, but as I said, these are still my songs, my production—my babies!''

Disco producer Cerrone/2006

...and 3 years later, that quote still turns my stomach.

[BrunoRepublic]

just stumbled across this...
...and 3 years later, that quote still turns my stomach.

Cerrone: The Gadhafi of disco.