Carol Williams Interview Now Up!

[Bernie]

Dayna caught up with singer Carol Williams for this nice interview. Check it out at http://www.discomusic.com/people-more/9518_0_11_0_C/

[Videoskooter]

Great to see all those legends visiting Dayna's couch! Another fine addition to the site! Thank you Miss Williams and thank you Miss Dayna!

[Disco Funk]

Great interview. Too bad she didn't do another album on Salsoul. That Lectric Lady record is probably the best record released on the label. Every song is great.

One song that didn't get the 12" treatment but sounded like it was recorded to be really long is 'My Time of Need'. That would be a nice one to hear in extended form, if it is languishing in the vaults.

The odd man out on the LP is Rattlesnake. That was done before the Philly tracks. Herb Rooney was the producer, and the 45 actually features the extended mix of the track, which isn't on the LP. Unfortunately, I find that Rattlesnake stands out too much because it's mix sounds too different from the other cuts on the album.

I'm not too crazy about her Tony Valor record.

Disco Funk

[originalbigm]

Most interesting interview.I was struck particularly on her comment about the best city or venue when she mentioned it was Toronto,Canada and that was my club Koutoubia which she headlined twice I believe either late 1975 and / or early 1976. It was the only club she played in Toronto as I recall. I even have my signed 12" of "More" from back then.In fact if what she claims is true then she has rewritten Disco history as we've all come to understand that 10 percent was the first commercially available 12".

[VINYLLIFE]

Just read the interview. Thanks so much Dayna! The Lectric Lady album is one of my favorites when listening to lp's all the way through. Wow did she work with some of the best or what. I too like Originalbigm was very interested in the fact that Carol's 12" was available before Ten Percents was. How cool would this be to discover this fact to be accurate here on DiscoMusic.com. A little shock wave out to the world to say the least.
Thanks again Dayna, we really do appreciate your efforts.

[discorecordplayer]

Is the Tony Valor album shes refering to "Reflections of"?
I have that one and I like it a lot.

Now I just need to get a copy of that Lectric Lady album. I have the "Love is You" single. Is that a song from the Lectrric Lady album or something?

[disco1999]

I am confused, I always thought Double Exposure - Ten Percent was the 1st commercial 12" available, here is a reference from discogs:

According to Billboard magazine in May 1976 and Tom Moulton's weekly Disco Mix column in Billboard, Ten Percent was the first commercially available 12" single in the U.S. Another interesting tidbit about this 12-inch is the Walter Gibbons Remix on the "A" side. Salsoul Records had a contest and invited all the New York DJs to submit remixes of the song before it was released; Walter Gibbons' version won. Ken Cayre, co-owner of Salsoul, mixed what is considered the "original" version on the B-side. Sadly, the album verison of "Ten Percent" was the Cayre mix.

[disco1999]

Now I just need to get a copy of that Lectric Lady album. I have the "Love is You" single. Is that a song from the Lectrric Lady album or something?

yes it is there
A1 Love Is You (5:08)A2 This Time May Be The Last Time (3:36)A3 More (5:40)A4 Just Feel (4:16)B1 My Time Of Need (3:42)B2 Come Back (3:40)B3 Danger Sign (4:49)B4 Rattlesnake (3:44)B5 You're So Much A Part Of Me (3:50)

[markydefad]

This "Who Had The First Commercial 12" Single?"....is interesting...
from the Vault....
Ten Per Cent (12")

Salsoul (US) 1976 / 12D-2008
12"-45 rpm



More (12")

Salsoul (US) / 1976 / 12D-2006
12" Disco SIngle 45 RPM vinyl record


However, in the Billboard articles from that era [see below], Double Exposure is proudly announced as the first--but there are also vague references to another forthcoming untitled release by Carol Williams....however, Carol's "More" had charted for 9 weeks starting 2/28/76--usually on just one chart a week-- before "Ten Percent" first charted 5/01/76....so either Salsoul thought that since "Ten Percent" had a bigger buzz they'd go with the press release that it was the "FIRST"..... or they purposely lied!!!

Billboard--May 15, 1976

SALSOUL HAS A 12-INCH DISCO SINGLE


A New 12-Inch 45 Salsoul Disco Label
By Rudy Garcia

NEW YORK—Salsoul Records has launched a special discotheque label, Salsoul Disco, with the release of the first 12-inch 45-r.p.m. single for commercial sale.

Suggested list price for the product will be $2.98; however, with a distributor net price of $1.28, it is expected that the disco single will be available at discount retailers for about $2.

There are several distinctive features of the commercial 12-inch single. Each record is inserted in a special universal four-color jacket with a center hole punched for label information to show through. The jacket contains only the label designation, allowing it to be used for all of the product to be released for that special market.

“Actually, it costs us a penny more to manufacture than an album,” says Chuck Gregory, Salsoul Records executive. “They charge us the extra cent to die-cut the hole.”

Joe Cayre, president of Cayre Industries, Inc., the label’s parent company, says the new venture was undertaken at the suggestion of numerous record dealers in those cities with heavy discotheque action. (continued on page 38)





....Cayre admits that he is going after a specialized market.

"The disco dancer market often changes the concept of selling quality mixes for dancing, rather than music for easy listening, but if that's what this specific customer wants, we feel we have the expertise to give it to him."

"After all, with the enormous success of the Salsoul Orchestra album which has been charted for eight months and has a third hit single from it coming along, we feel we are pioneers in the disco business. If we're pioneers, then it falls on us to break new ground which we feel we're doing with this 12-inch single."

"We're not really going into it blind. We have had encouraging reports from the main disco market areas and studied the problem for three months before deciding to move," Cayre explains.

Dealers will be given special promotional material to display with the product with heavy emphasis through the local discos.

"It may be that in some areas where dealers are reluctant to try the new 12-inch single we may have to make it available through the discos themselves, " Gregory says.

"But right now we hope that with in-store displays and demonstration play we'll be able to avoid that route and use it to bring a new specialty market to the retailers. The next releases will be by Carol Williams and will contain both an uptempo disco tune and a ballad which will also give us a chance to test the marketability of the music before releasing the regular single."

"One of the main purposes for providing this product for a specialized market is to get the disco dancers into the retail store," Cayre adds. "Disk jockey versions of innumerable disco hits are selling as collector's items, when available, for as much as $7 per disk, which leads us to believe that there is a viable market for this product."

Cayre and Gregory maintain that people who have spent a night dancing to the extended disco versions would like to be able to buy the same product the next day. Usually they can't because the record is commercially available only in the edited versions used for radio and regular album cuts."

The first Salsoul Disco release by Double Exposure, a group signed to Salsoul Records. Called "Ten Percent," it contains two different mixes of the same tune, one lasting 7:07 minutes and the other 9:15 minutes. It has been commercially available as a standard 45-r.p.m. 7-inch disk in a much shorter version.

"Through our disco and retail research," Cayre says, "we've discovered that a disco record often has a longer period of popularity than a standard pop record."

"As the demand for this type of product is increasing, and as most people's home listening and lighting equipment becomes more sophisticated, they can easily create the atmosphere of a disco in their own living rooms, and often prefer the better sounding extended versions which can be cut hotter as a result of the wider grooves."

"Of course, the other problem is that of mechanical royalties," Gregory goes on. "Naturally we can't expect to pay the same for a nine-minute version as we would for a three or four-minute cut. But deals can be made and accommodations worked out where everyone can benefit."

"I do see it limiting the use somewhat of outside material for songs for which the label also has the publishing rights. This is only to give the product a real chance to catch on in the street before having to pay out mechanicals."

Both Cayre and Gregory feel that the 12-inch disco disk is not an expensive item given the amount of music contained.

"A regular album contains about 36 to 40 minutes of music and our disco single will have between 16 and 18 minutes," Gregory says. "If you figure that a regular album sells for $6.98 list and the disco single for $2.98 it works out just about the same."

Some dealers have reacted rather skeptically to the idea; however, the Downstairs Store in New York, Record Museum in Philadelphia, Gary's in Washington and Grammophone Records in San Francisco all placed healthy initial orders, apparently believing the market exists. [RUDY GARCIA]
__________________________________________________ ______________

June 19, 1976

12-inch 45 Disco Disk Sales Brisk

by Rudy Garcia

[New York] Sales of the first commercial 12-inch 45 r.p.m. disco single released last month by the Salsoul Disco label have been "excellent" in the test market areas and will lead to the release of two more disks and a wider distribution program this month, according to Joe Cayre, president of the Caytronics Corp., the label's parent company.

Cayre's evaluation was substantiated by several retail outlets throughout the country which were asked to report on the popular acceptance of the product.

The 12-inch single provides lengthy disco versions of recorded product which previously had been made available as promotional copies to discotheques. Carrying a list price of $2.98, but selling for about $2.29, the record is packaged in a universal four-color album jacket allowing the pancake label to provide title and artist information.

The first release by Salsoul contains two versions, one of 7:07 minutes and one of 9:15 minutes, of the song "Ten Percent" sung by a new group, Double Exposure, featuring the Salsoul Orchestra.

"If both the 12-inch and the standard single had been released at the same time, the sales of the big record would have been even greater," Gary Friedman of Gary's Records in Washington, D.C. As it is, the sales are great, particularly for our kind of clientèle who are really into disco. What happens is that when they hear the record in a club they want it right away, so a lot of our people already had the standard size single when the long version was released."

In Philadelphia, Albert Dakins of the Record Museum chain reports that sales of the 12-inch album-size disk have been impressive.

"The big record is selling very well. As a matter of fact, it's outselling the standard single by 10 to one. It's not only the r&b and club people who are buying it. We're even getting people who are into rock 'n' roll asking for the record," Dakins says.

Dakins adds that in-store play has helped sales, but that local radio has been instrumental in pushing the product.

"There are several stations in town which are playing the 7-minute version and one station which is heavy into disco sound, has been playing the 9-minute version at least once an hour. That has really helped sales because the people hear the long version and want to buy it," he says.

In New York, Dave Rothfeld of Korvette's reports that the first day the item was put on the 34th St. store's shelves, it sold over 200 units. "It's the hottest item I have had in years in that store. It looks like Joe Cayre has got a winner with this idea," he says.

At the Grammophone Shop in San Francisco, the report is that sales of the disco version are "phenomenal."

"We had to reorder several times in the first two weeks," says Dean Stamatopolos of Grammophone. "This record is a whole new thing for the industry and I think it's the biggest thing to hit the industry in a long time because it's giving the customer something between the small single and the LP."

Dean adds that the sales have been great, particularly for us since we're heavy into disco. [FYI, The Grammophone was located near the popular disco Buzzby's on Polk Street.] At the $2.29 price it's selling real well, but I kind of expected that because I've been an advocate for such a product for a long time. I just didn't think anyone would come out with it so soon."

"If they keep the quality of the product up, it will continue to sell. That's the key to the whole thing. We play it in the store and we have a window display, all of which helps. It's also good because the customers know they can stack these at home and really get to dance a while which they can't do with the standard single."

But the continued success of the item will always depend on the quality of the product. "If it's a bummer, I don't care how much of a novelty it is, it won't sell,' Dean says.

Chuck Gregory, Salsoul's marketing chief, believes another key is to produce the long single as a 45 r.p.m. item instead of the 33 &1/3 r.p.m., as is the case with the most previously released promotional discotheque versions.

"There are two reasons for the 45 r.p.m. speed," says Gregory. "One is practical and the other is psychological. On the practical side is the fact that the wider groove allows you to turn it up and play it real hot without popping the needle out of the groove."

'The psychological reason for the 45 r.p.m. speed is the fact that even a 9-minute version at 33 & 1/3 would still only take up a relatively small portion of the vinyl in a 12-inch pancake and the customer would see this and think he is being cheated. The faster speed takes up more space and doesn't call the customer's attention to a lot of unused vinyl space."

In future releases, one of which is set for new artist Carol Williams, plans are for each record to contain two different songs instead of two different versions of one song.

Apparently, reports on the brisk sales of the commercial 12-inch single have reached other ears because several companies with disco product are considering joining the bandwagon, although none have announced definite release plans as yet.
__________________________________________________ ______________
[UPDATED: 7/16/06] Now the beggining of this article is available for your reading pleasure. In case you don't wanna miss a thing....


May 15, 1976

age 1—Club DJs Blend Cuts For Cos.’ Disco Disks By Jim Melanson

NEW YORK—Blending of final-mix disco tracks by club DJs for commercial and 12-inch promotional releases is the latest twist in the ongoing discotheque scene.

Both Scepter and Salsoul have opted to come with disks featuring spinner blending, Scepter on “Nice And Slow” by Jesse Green and Salsoul on “Ten Per Cent” by the group Double Exposure.

Walter Gibbons, DJ at Galaxy 21 here worked the Double Exposure tune while Howard Metz, spinner at Los Angeles’ Circus Maximus club, gets blending credit on the Scepter record. (continued on page 39)


CLUB DJS MIXING MASTERS

(continued from page 1)

Notably, the development stacks up as a mini-breakthrough for label-disco DJ relations, as a number of labels have sought to involve spinners in various phases of production of disks aimed at the dance set without much success to date.

In most cases, either the spinners weren't sophisticated enough for in-studio a&r work or they found their paths blocked by well-entrenched producers and mixers already familiar with the dance sound.

One exception, though, has been RCA's David Todd, DJ at Adam's Apple here, who's been acting in the capacity of a&r consultant and promotional coordinator on disco product from the label.

"We broke our first record via the discos and that's where our strength still is," says Salsoul's Ken Cayre. He explains that going to [Walter] Gibbons for a blending of two separate tracks (one a vocal, the other an instrumental) was part of a conscious effort to make product appealing to discos.

The tracks provided to Gibbons were final-mixes which ran approximately four minutes in length. The spinner, who blended the tracks at the Frank Ford Wayne Laboratories here and who was paid $185 for his efforts, produced the 9:45 version.

That version was used for 12-inch disco disks sent out for airplay (2,500 in all) and has recently been used on the flip side of a commercial 12-inch 45 r.p.m. record shipped by the label (see separate story).

Cayre says that the $185 broke down to $85 to cover Gibbons salary at the club for the night and $100 for the blending. Gibbons is given credit for the blend on both the commercial and promotional pressings.

The record, featuring the four-man group Double Exposure, was arranged by Norman Harris and produced by Baker/Harris/Young Productions.

"We feel that disco spinners are better equipped to judge the public's response to disco product," explains Cayre. He says that the label hopes to involve other area DJs in the future releases, for blending as well as for the mixing purposes.

Over at Scepter, label executive Mel Cheren says that [Howard] Metz' involvement happened inadvertently. The West Coast player received a promotional copy of the single "Nice and Slow," with a 3:05 vocal version on one side and a 4:40 instrumental version on the flip side, for club exposure.

Without being asked, Metz blended both versions and came up with a new 5:45 version and passed it along to Scepter's Patrick Jenkins, who sent it back to Cheren here.

Cheren, who mixed the original two versions, says that he was impressed enough with Metz' new versions to go back into the studio using the blended version as a guideline for a new mix.

The new Cheren/Metz blend-mix is the one going out to clubs via 12-inch promotional disks (1,600 copies).

How much Metz was paid Cheren wouldn't say, but he does state that Metz is given credit on the blended disk version.

It's also planned to use the new version for the second run of commercial copies pressed, adds Cheren.

Interestingly, the 12-incher also marks a first for Scepter in that it's used to promote product on separate labels. The flip side features the tune "I Get Lifted" by Sweet Music, which records for Scepter-distributed
Wand. "Nice And Slow" is on Scepter itself.

Cheren says he's long sought to involve club spinners in label activities and that he's hopeful that this latest development will help the flow of communication between the camps.

"The disco DJs are the kids with the ears," he says.

Midland International had used a local spinner on the production and final mix of Marboo's "What About Love" single last December but, according to a label spokesman, there are no plans at present to build on it. The feeling is that in-house capability meets the need.

__________________________________________________ _____________


June 26, 1976

NEW LABELS ADD 12-INCH SINGLES

By Tom Melanson & Tom Moulton

(NEW YORK) - A greater market impact from the new commercial 12-inch disco single is expected shortly as a number of labels here have given the go-ahead on releasing retail versions of disks previously used for promotional purposes only.

Indications are that within the next few weeks there will be more than a dozen titles commercially available on 12-inch disks. The goods will come from Roulette, CTI, Scepter, RCA-distributed Midland International and possibly Amherst.

In effect, a mini-bandwagon is being created behind Salsoul Records recent first move in this area. Salsoul itself is planning to add more 12-inchers as a followup to its groundbreaking release last month. (Billboard, June 19).


The $2.98 suggested list used by Salsoul has been uniformly picked up by other labels. Cost to distributors does vary from label to label, though.

It’s expected that actual store price on the disks will be in the range of $2.29, as has been the case with Salsoul’s ”Ten Percent” title.

Interestingly, the uniformity in the march into the 12-inch camp does break down when it comes to record speed. Both 33 & 1/3 and 45-r.p.m. disks will be involved.

Also noteworthy is that some of the records will couple two different artists performing their respective songs. The buyer, in effect, will be offered two A-side singles on the same disk.

First to follow Salsoul’s lead was Scepter, which shipped a 12-incher last week, featuring Jesse Green and the group Sweet Music, one of the coupled disks.

According to label executive Mel Cheren, only a couple of thousand copies were shipped, and only to such disco-oriented cities such as Los Angeles, Detroit and New York.

Even though Salsoul has reported strong response to the 12-inch single concept, Cheren explains that Scepter prefers to go slowly and test-market for itself.

Titles on the record are Greene’s ”Nice And Slow” (5:45) and Sweet Music’s ”I Get Lifted” (6:10).

He says that no free goods will be involved, and that distributor cost for each record is $1.50.

The Scepter disk is at 33 & 1/3 so as to allow listeners to play it without having to change speed from their LPs, explains Cheren.

CTI ships “Summertime 2001 (A-side) and ”Theme From Good King Bad” (B-side) Monday (21), says Jerry Wagner, vice president, marketing. The featured artist is George Benson.

Initial press run is 20,000 copies, explains Wagner. He adds that regular commercial 7-inch disks are also being shipped.

The 12-inch record has a 7:16 running time on the A-side and a 6 minute length on the flip side. The speed is 45 r.p.m.

Gross distributor price on CTI’s disk is $1.54, while the free goods net is $1.28.

At Roulette/Pyramid, four 12-inch releases are planned to hit the market by early July, according to Dennis Ganim, president, Pyramid, and Ira Leslie, national sales manager.

Each of the releases will feature coupled artists, four from the Pyramid labels and four from Roulette.

The Pyramid disks will pair D.C. LaRue (”Cathedrals” with Pat Lundy [says “Pay!”] (“Day By Day/ My Sweet Lord” medley) and Jakki (“Sun, Sun, Sun”) with Phil Medley & MVB (“Snap It”) .

The Roulette releases will pair Four Below Zero (“My Baby’s Got ESP”) with Gentleman And Their Lady (“Like Her!”) and Poison (“Do You Wanna Do”) with Stratavarious featuring Lady (“I Got Your Love”).

Net cost to distributors will be $1.25. All records will be packaged in a cardboard jacket with a dye-cut center hole and shrink-wrapped. The record will be 45 r.p.m.

While an exact shipping date couldn’t be firmed for its first 12-inch commercial disco disk, word from Bob Reno at Midland International is that the next Silver Convention single will go out as both a 12-incher and as a regular single. Again, the suggested list will be $2.98, but what the RCA branch price to dealers would be was not available.

Amherst’s Barry Lyons, national marketing director, explains that the label is seriously toying with releasing 12-inch commercial copies. They are researching now and the status of the project is iffy, he explains. He does add though, that the company will eventually come with 12-inch retail disco disks.

The label has released a promotional copy of Chicago Gangsters’ ”Gangster Love” (7:32), but if the go-ahead is given, it will come in all likelihood on a forthcoming single by the group Whole Darn Family (Soul International label). Speed preference at Amherst is 33 & 1/3.

Also coming from Salsoul will be a commercial 12-inch disk from Carol Williams. [what was the title of this??? They keep mentioning her in every column yet fail to mention that Moment Of Truth will release a commercial 12" of "So Much For Love" b/w "Helplessly" (a longer mix than the 1975 version-- both mixed by Tom Moulton; however my 12" of "SMFL" has an instrumental version on the flip side...(???)]

It’s also expected that as more and more commercial copies find their way into the market, other labels releasing just promotional versions will follow the commercial route. __________________

[disco1999]

I am still confused

We can't just rely on the catalog # to decide if a record was released earlier or not. Obviously someone is not telling the whole truth. :icon_mrgreen:

[salsouldiscokid]

I am still confused

We can't just rely on the catalog # to decide if a record was released earlier or not. Obviously someone is not telling the whole truth. :icon_mrgreen:

from what i can remember, ''MORE'' came out the same time as 'ten percent', but becuase of lack of promotion on carol's 'MORE' ten percent ended up standing out ,so salsoul pushed the press release to make ten percent first. history was made and carol williams is definetly a big part of disco history. lectric lady was a great album for 1976 it was more than just a disco album the ballads were great like philly soul sound this time maybe the last time, just feel,danger sign,i saw carol back in the days perform live with the salsoul orchestra at roseland and i seen her with her live band in all the major disco clubs her energy on the stage was remarkable she gave so much and you felt it. i did not get that feeling from alot of other disco acts. i just ordered a bunch of cds with carol's songs
unidisc has some good quality stuff and suss'd records UK

CAROL WILLIAMS LECTRIC LADY ON CD cat #agek-2426 unidisc
MORE, LOVE IS YOU,COME BACK, great product of salsoul
CANT GET AWAY was a classic too on vanguard records

[Dayna]

I think Carol herself would know better than a bunch of contradictory articles or stats..and I also dont think she would announce it on a highly visible website if it werent true.She is obviously privy to information we are not..
I speak to Carol often and know her to be a "LADY"
better yet a "LECTRIC LADY...

[zeca azevedo]

Great interview! LOVE IS YOU is an amazing record, still great after more than 30 years! LOVE IS YOU is a very appreciated record among disco & soul fans here in Brasil.

[garrybcoston]

Hmm hmm. Another "show stopping" interview by Ms. Dayna on Ms. Williams. Great stuff. Be glad though when we can get Loleatta Holloway on the board, Ms. Williams and others are greats as well; but you can see, even Carol Williams somewhat worshipped Loleatta Holloway. Can't wait!

Garry

[djscream67]

I love Carol Williams' music! My favorite BITD was 'Can't Get Away (From Your Love)' in 1982. That rhythm is stuck in my head forever! God bless her!

[Chap2Power]

Most interesting interview.I was struck particularly on her comment about the best city or venue when she mentioned it was Toronto,Canada and that was my club Koutoubia which she headlined twice I believe either late 1975 and / or early 1976. It was the only club she played in Toronto as I recall. I even have my signed 12" of "More" from back then.In fact if what she claims is true then she has rewritten Disco history as we've all come to understand that 10 percent was the first commercially available 12".

She was close to Toronto DJ Legend John Weber, and she performed at Studio II as well when she was here. John introduced her to me, and I actually produced a song "Nobody" that I wrote with the late Andrew Komis which was later covered by Pandella. I'll try and upload it if I can find a cassette of it. Her then 12 year old son also made an appearance on it.

She's a legend, and a complete sweetheart.

Vince

[salsouldiscokid]

Great to see all those legends visiting Dayna's couch! Another fine addition to the site! Thank you Miss Williams and thank you Miss Dayna!

CAROL WILLIAMS WILL BE PERFORMING WITH THE TRAMMPS & TAVARES LIVE JAN 31,2009

AT QUEENS BORO PERFORMING ATRS CENTER CAROL WILL BE PERFORMING ALL HER HITS FROM THE SALSOUL ORCHESTRA DO NOT MISS THIS ONE NIGHT FLASH BACK DISCO CONCERT
''MORE'' LOVE IS YOU'' DANCE THE NIGHT AWAY'' COME BACK''

THE SHOW WILL START AT 7:30 SHARP

MySpace.com - Carol Williams First lady of salsoul - QUEENS VILLAGE, New York - Disco House / R&B / Pop - www.myspace.com/carolwilliamsfirstladyofsalsoul