Reply With QuoteVery interesting idea, but what about copyrights?
I am not an expert on that.
But don't you think someone else has thought to realize mixes?
If it could be possible, I would have a loooot !!!!!!
Underground Hit [Level 5]
About a year and a half ago I purchased the "Paradise Garage" double CD by Larry Levan. For those of you that own this once sought after CD, you probably already know it isn't all that. Many of the mixes are kind of shabby and the volume is not well controlled on some of the mixes.
For those of us in the hmm...40+ crowd that remember those wonderful days back in the late 1970's when all the disco classics were at there peak, you will probably remember how spectacular the mixes were. In fact the mixing really made the music all the more wonderful. A DJ had the ability to create an entire mood change throughout a disco in the blink of an eye. Mixing back then was an art form, not like today where so much of the music sounds alike. Sadly, the younger people really have no idea what they missed.
Today, we have a lot of the old disco music available on CD, however, very little is available that is mixed. And when it is, it is often like the Paradise Garage CD. So, my question is has anyone ever considered making a really nice double CD that is well mixed to be marketed? I'm not an expert on the legalities of it, but my understanding is that many of the record companies that hold the copyrights could be interested in this kind of production since they would get a piece of the pie along with the potential of inspiring the music to come back into vogue. :-?
Underground Hit [Level 5]
Very interesting idea, but what about copyrights?
I am not an expert on that.
But don't you think someone else has thought to realize mixes?
If it could be possible, I would have a loooot !!!!!!
People all over the world, It\'s time for love & understanding, Come together!!
No Longer Charting
Rab: I suspect that the mixes in the clubs, actually weren't as hot as you remember. The Larry Levan CD is from tapes of the day or mixed just prior to release, a few years back? He was considered one of the best wasn't he?
There have been lots of mixed albums and CDs so far as I can tell and don't forget that a lot of the early 'mixed' albums were actually fairly loose segues, in that they merely started the next record on the beat, at the fade of the previous record.
I'd personally sooner have full tracks than mixes any day. Mixes and why and what makes them work, are sooooo personal.
Double Platinum Record [Level 9]
As compilations go, I'd have to agree. Not that I don't like hearing a good mix, but I like to have the ability to take the tracks and put them on my own compilations if I choose. I really liked the approach that BBE took with the "Disco Forever" compilation. It consists of three discs: two containing the original tracks, and a very nice mix on the third. So, you get to have your cake and eat it too.Originally Written by QUINNY
Double Platinum Record [Level 9]
I think the legal issues alone would make it just about impossible for an "at home" dj to mix and sell our favorite club music. Sell it LEGALLY and make a profit at it. Hell, even Puff Daddy cried the P. Diddy blues when Motown charged him so many thousands for an 8-second sample of their music.
As for mixed CD's, I don't go for them. For me it's personal because as a dj I just like to make my own mixes. Can't do that if another dj has taken that away. Also, unless I was in the club or know the dj, it doesn't really do that much except let me appreciate his or her technical skill. You don't get the real vibe and energy that they were trying to create.
I'd rather hear the djs' skills at remixing --- this I can get into. I never had the pleasure of meeting Junior Vasquez but his remix work is extroadinary. I've never purchased a mixed down CD of his simply because I've never seen him live so it doesn't hold much appeal for me.
Frankie Knuckles is a different story. I've got old feelings there so his mixes and remixes work very well for me.
Love Has No Time or Place
Nicky
Underground Hit [Level 5]
[quote="Masdefi"]To be honest with you Masdefi, I don't think there has been a lot of people that have given it a lot of thought, and the people that have done it, such as Larry Levan I don't think have anymore clout than anyone else that knows what there doing.Very interesting idea, but what about copyrights?
I am not an expert on that.
But don't you think someone else has thought to realize mixes?
As far as copyrights, I don't think it would take that much work to contact a record company and ask them what they thought of having their material reproduced in a mixed track. After all that was basically how the Paradise Garage CD and other similar CD's have been produced.
We have to keep one thing in mind as well, especially Europeans. Here in the U.S. disco from the mid to late 1970's is all but completely dead. This music has an extremely small market, regardless of what many of us disco junkies want to believe. Here in the U.S. disco became a dirty word. The goal here is not necessarily about making a lot of money off the deal anyway. The idea is to do it for the love of this music. To understand that there is a whole generation that did not have the privilege of enjoying this music in its limelight. Of course, if you are a DJ or have DJ equipment you not necessary part of the targeted market. It would be mostly people like myself, who only own 1 turntable.
Mixing back then was about more than just matching beats, it was about enhancing the club atmosphere with intricate mood changes. Some of the songs would gradually creep in; or maybe a drastic cut from one record to the other. Many of these guys really knew what they were doing. One screw-up and the dance floor would clear immediately.
As for Quinny, I'm not sure what the environment is like in England, particularly back in the late 1970's, but truthfully without any exageration, the mixes were that fantasic in the clubs in Boston and New York (I've only been in the gay ones). We had 2 disco radio stations back then KISS108 & WBOS here in Boston that were incredible. What was nice, is that the DJ on staff would let listeners know when the mixing would begin and to have their tapes ready. Unfortunately, I only made a couple and they were both on 8-track. Larry Levan may have been a legend, but he might have been having an off day when the Paradise Garage CD was produced. There are a few good mixes, and a slew of bad ones. Unfortunately, a lot of those legends I remember from both the clubs and the radio stations are no longer even with us today.
....It was just an idea, I was just wondering if anyone else gave it any thought...
Triple Platinum Record [Level 10]
Regarding Quinny's comment on Larry Levan's "mixing ability"...I've heard just the opposite. Flawless mixing WASN'T his stong suit....selecting the "right" records, creating a mood and taking dancers on a long trip WAS his specialty. Now, never having heard him play in person, I have to repeat that's what I've read or heard from others who did dance to his music at Paradise Garage.
But ya know it''s interesting to hear "live tapes" from back in the day...cause the mixes are often NOT flawless....but damned if I could tell it when I was on the dance floor dancing to them. You can hear obvious pitching up and down on the tape that was never apparent in the club. At least --NOT TO ME!!! :roll:
So I guess it's not really fair to judge a DJ's merit on how the mixes from back in the day sound on CD today. I'm just grateful to hear how he put together a string of tunes and created a mood. And I'm fascinated by the legendary stories of DJ ego and bad temperament--like Larry Levan playing one record repeatedly over and over and over and over--UNTIL he got the reaction from the crowd he felt the record deserved!!!! Unheard of to me--punishing your dancers--and STILL they came!!! That's a cult of DJ personality that I find most interesting.
"Lost inside adorable illusion...."
Platinum Record [Level 8]
All those drugs made the mixes sound good. :D :D :D
Platinum Record [Level 8]
Hey Rab, speaking of dancing in Boston, several years ago someone gave me some tapes from a club in Boston called Darts.
Did you ever dance there? The mixing on the tapes is nothing special, but there are some obscure disco ditties on the tape.
Triple Platinum Record [Level 10]
All those drugs made the mixes sound good. :D :D :D
Hmmmm....
Well, it's probably MY fault...but my rumored "drug-use" has been greatly exaggerated. Just enough crystal to make my feet wanna dance the night away. NEVER used it unless I was going to Trocadero or to another "all night dancing" establishment. Yet, somehow I've become the poster child for the "druggie" dancer!!!!! :roll:
"Lost inside adorable illusion...."
Underground Hit [Level 5]
Rab, with all due respect, I disagree with you. If disco isn't popular among some people in the USA (read: substantial niche market), how do you explain the following:
* All the new disco compilations, most recently the hit-laden "Monster Disco" advertised on TV
* Classic disco music getting into lots of recent movies, like "Rush Hour 2" and "The Full Monty" (I gave some other examples in another recent post of mine.)
* Saturday night party radio programs in California, New York, and Connecticut and other states where disco music is played for hours at a time (and they do get requests)
* Re-releases of disco albums by Michael Jackson, Chic, and Donna Summer (just to name some obvious ones) are selling pretty well. Even Saturday Night Fever is still selling in the States.
* New concert tours by disco and funk artists like Chic, K.C. and the Sunshine Band, Thelma Houston, Donna Summer, the Brothers Johnson, etc. have been getting big crowds in the USA. The fans are coming out of the woodwork.
* "The Disco Ball: A 30 Year Celebration" will be aired on ABC; it was taped in October and has live performances by Chic, Gloria Gaynor, Thelma Houston, the Village People, and more.
* A museum exhibit called "Disco: A Decade of Saturday Nights" by the Experience Music Project (Seattle, Washington) is running now thru May 2003.
* Both the original version and various remakes of "We Are Family" are always on the radio and television for some promotion or another (from local businesses to the WE television channel for women), and was even remade last year as a September 11 fundraiser.
* Nostalgia in general for the '70s among 30- and 40-somethings.
* Americans who traveled to Europe and heard songs like "Little L" by Jamiroquai and "Murder on the Dancefloor" by Sophie Ellis Bextor said they loved the music (essentially disco with modern production techniques). Check out the American-consumer reviews at Amazon.com. Another good example: At the Amazon review for "The Best of Peaches and Herb", a New Mexico consumer writes "its disco and old skool at its finest. Too bad we don't hear music like this anymore on the radio." And he's not alone in that sentiment - I saw it many, many times from Americans.
* Barry Manilow fans who bought the "Here at the Mayflower" CD said they liked "Let's Dance!", and this song is like a nostalgic trip back to the days of Saturday Night Fever with its Travolta name-dropping in a lyric and the disco ball Barry has on stage during his concerts when he performs "Let's Dance!".
* The black station WYBC FM in New Haven, Connecticut has a great daily hour-long program called the "Old School Drive at Five", and people love it.
* People feel more free to talk about what they like and don't like, since this isn't 23 years ago; besides, rap and teen-pop are more embarrassing, or at least should be.
* Most of the idiots who hate disco today and say "disco still sucks" are white male heavy-metal and hard-rock fans. They don't represent the whole country by any means. And not all disco fans are gay or black either. I'm certainly neither.
* This is not the only disco forum nor the only forum where people talk about disco casually; just because there is no centralized "disco culture" and just because radio doesn't give airtime to old and new acts that are popular in Europe doesn't mean there isn't a wide existing and potential audience for new disco CDs and compilations. And some young people today could be educated on what good disco is, even if older folks already made up their minds one way or another. There are 20 year olds who just discovered music by Chic or Gloria Gaynor and think it's the greatest thing. (I know because I watch the guestbooks and message boards.)
Just because '70s disco isn't a major part of commercial radio today (though it's pretty big in R&B circles where it's simply called "old-school jams") doesn't mean people don't like it (even if many don't admit it publicly or aren't heavily into it). Why not conduct an anonymous scientific survey of people chosen at random and find out how many really like or dislike disco? I think you're going on anecdotal assumptions like the "fear factor" of saying the word "disco" or the lingering stereotypes about disco or what you heard from some people you spoke with or because you're a member of an oppressed minority. But record labels that re-released old albums now claim that the disco stigma is much diminished; an example would be the wording on the Sister Sledge "We Are Family" CD release from Rhino Records (1995).
It's all about "positioning". Rick Dees successfully repositioned disco as a silly joke. Are you going to let that stand? EMP is trying to, in their words, "forever change people's thinking about a musical genre that has been hugely important and hugely misunderstood." Maybe they will succeed, maybe not. But you'll never get everyone to universally like ANY genre of music. So what? If say 20 percent of the American public likes disco, that's good enough. At its peak, disco is said to have represented only 20 percent of all record sales.
I know how to promote niche products to wide audiences and how to track people the appropriate people down to inform them of new and classic disco music. I think other people know how to do the same.
Underground Hit [Level 5]
I don't remember a club called "Darts". It may have been a straight club, if so, this would explain why the mixing wasn't all that. The late 70's was the time period when the drinking age was going up gradually. If you remember it was 18 for several years, then went up a year to 19, 20 and so on. I was always 1 year behind, and the "carding" was fierce in Boston. Providence was 1 year behind Mass. in increasing the age limit which was why so many young people were going accross the state line to party. Providence at the time was definetly ahead of its time as well. Those here in the northeast know this city is all about partying....gay or straight.
Anyways, almost all the clubs had pretty good mixing at the time but, "Buddy's", "Pipeline" and "Chaps" ( Chaps, prevsly called "Styx" until around 1978) had incredible mixing! I can remember hearing things like, the proceeding/next record creeping in during break portion of a 12" then fad out, at just the right time. It is difficult to explain the effects in words, but I can remember hearing specific mixes that I made a mental note to try and create on my own later on. I really admired the imagination it took creating the various mood changes those guys would create.
As far as discosavvy's dissagreeing, that is fine I hope your right. But, I think disco might be experiencing a bit of an upswing based more on memorabilia/nostalgia. I don't think a radio station that waits till after 10:00pm to play a few disco classics means disco is on an upswing. While there might be a stereotype of disco-haters as being white straight boy heavy metal heads, I would be careful on this site. I've learned the hard way. But, truthfully without the gay boys disco won't experience much of any upswing. One can really enjoy the music, but unless you were out in the limelight at the time you cannot possibly imagine how spactacular it was. The straight clubs really didn't have the cache. Disco represented a real "great to be alive" feeling at the time. I will cherish those memories forever.
Platinum Record [Level 8]
No, this was definitely recorded at a gay club. The person who gave me the tape was gay.I don't remember a club called "Darts". It may have been a straight club, if so, this would explain why the mixing wasn't all that. imagination it took creating the various mood changes those guys would create.
Underground Hit [Level 5]
Hi Rab, thanks for sharing your thoughts. But I wouldn't judge whether disco is popular or not based on whether commercial radio stations play disco all day long. It's like a catch-22. First, disco is perceived as an old style that is no longer current, so its playtime is limited to 6 or 7 hours on Saturday nights on some pop stations across the USA (actually, the broadcasting of disco on WEBE FM starts at 7pm, not 10pm, but I understand your point). Because of this same perception, new disco songs by Jamiroquai and Sophie Ellis Bextor don't get airtime in the USA, despite their worldwide popularity. Thus, people who like (or, in the case of young people, would like) disco, or at least the disco sound even if they don't like the name "disco", do not have the opportunity to hear new disco at all, and old disco only in limited timespans. So this leads to the perception that disco has no future in this country and that everyone really wants only rock, country, or rap. The problem is compounded by the fact that R&B stations that still play classic disco at all times of day don't also play new disco, because their focus is on new R&B ballads. Most radio stations I wrote to are also not very receptive to new song ideas, so the programs stay the same week after week. In short, American radio is boring and not in tune with what's happening in Europe, but I guarantee you that there are at least a few million people in the USA who like disco and always liked it, and they have no voice in the music business and aren't catered to by Top-40 radio nor by music surveys which no doubt don't ask about disco, house, techno, or anything else non-mainstream. But somehow Kylie Minogue's "Can't Get You Out of My Head" got popular and lots of airtime (though I think is a boring song). Wouldn't fans of that song be receptive to quality disco too? I think so. The problem as I see it is that American disco fans don't get to hear any of the new material unless they actively seek it out. And maybe it's not "hip" for the younger crowd to listen to disco if no one else you know is -- another catch-22. And so most people don't rush out to buy a new disco single because they don't know it exists.
You're right that the playlists and atmospheres of gay clubs might have been more exciting than most straight clubs (and a recent novel "Love The One You're With" by James Earl Hardy in chapter 4 makes the generalized point that the straight playlists were inferior with disco songs by artists like Leo Sayer and Rod Stewart and didn't have enough representation from black females etc.) but I'm not talking about club audiences, but rather the public at large. The market is out there, but unreached by modern radio; but if CD sales are any indication there must be profits to be made if so many look-alike compilations can be sold in large numbers. With the future recovery of Internet radio in sight and new technologies like WiFi, it might be that a few years from now Americans will have many more easily-available choices, as broad a diversity as Brits claim to already get on the radio dial. So I would be cautiously optimistic about the future, and my definition of success with a format might be different than a corporate radio owner's.
And even if it was just a nostalgic trip for most people, it was fun to see disco come back for a little while.
Underground Hit [Level 5]
I found something interesting in Summit Daily News from Colorado. Kimberly Nicoletti wrote an article on November 8, 2002 called "Retro becomes mainstream". The gist of the article is that people still like music from decades ago AND that disco is among the true favorites. The article starts off with "Disco never dies, especially in Summit County, where tourists flock to Friday's Frisco Disco at Barkley's and Cecilia's Mondays." Dan Fallon, owner of Barkley's, says he's been playing disco for 4 years (for comparison purposes, WEBE FM in Connecticut has been broadcasting disco for 6-8 hours each week for over 7 years). Fallon says "Disco is still the best dance music around... Disco is the fundamental programming building block." and Nicoletti writes "Dan Fallon believes disco has moved back into the mainstream... However, in contrast to disco, he sees the 80s resurgence as a passing trend." Then she quotes Fallon as saying that disco has "staying power", in contrast to Cecilia's manager Scott Gongaware who says "we may not stick to the disco format very much longer". Meanwhile, some other clubs have also been going with an '80s-music theme, such as some in Denver since last year, but I sure hope Fallon is right.
Gold Record [Level 7]
I think Rab's is a good idea, and in fact it's been done. Maybe not in an all-disco CD, but look at the mix CDs of Dimitri from Paris, Prodigy or the Chemicals "Brothers gonna work it out". They tend to put some Cerrone or Costandinos inbetween the hard techno beats of today. Prodigy even included a Sex Pistols track! And that must cost a bloooody lot, isn't it Mr. "Filthy Lucre" Lydon?
So maybe it can be done. Of course, it's easier if you are a fashion European DJ star...
It don't mean a thing (if ain't got that swing)
Double Platinum Record [Level 9]
Larry's repeated playing of a song is just another example of technique taken from Nicky Siano and credited to Mr.Levan.And I'm fascinated by the legendary stories of DJ ego and bad temperament--like Larry Levan playing one record repeatedly over and over and over and over--UNTIL he got the reaction from the crowd he felt the record deserved!!!! Unheard of to me--punishing your dancers--and STILL they came!!! That's a cult of DJ personality that I find most interesting.
When Nicky wanted to 'promote' a song at The Gallery, you would hear it "a lot". If the record was at a certain tempo where it would fit nicely throughout the evening, then prepare yourself. He wanted you to get into it.
Nicky also did something else that was brazen, and also stolen: Once in a great while, if he flubbed a mix, he would immediately mix back into what he just came out of and then repeat the mix correctly. It startled the crowd but they loved it! I'm sure Larry did that at The Garage. I know I did it at The Anvil. Sometimes you just got to prove yourself :lol: .
It just amazes me that so many of the Garage members were Gallery members and they still credit Larry with, well, IMO, a lot of "style" that is truly not original.
Love Has No Time or Place
Nicky
No Longer Charting
Nicky: I don't know if anyone would actually want the dubious honour of being known as the DJ who played a track repeatedly in order to break it. :lol:
You know what is said, innovators rarely get noticed.
Back on track.
If Disco is to find a larger audience it will probably be when internet radio takes off, leading to a large syndicated terrestrial radio station then picking up on the vibe and spreading the word. Will that happen? I very much doubt it, unless the over 50's get vocal and angry. I suspect disco will have a brief comeback, rather akin to the recent hullaballou that was caused by that very small, niche Big Band trip in NY. Suddenly, even national TV news in the UK, was proclaiming that Big Band was the latest thing in NY. HYPE, HYPE, HYPE, HYPE, HYPE.
Salsa is the one 'old' music that truly appears to have grabbed a multitude of people lately and grown in strength (over the past 5 years or so). To stay relatively hip (with a wide cross section of ages) after so long is amazing. The BBC even has people dancing Salsa as one of its main TV channel (BBC1) station idents.
Advance Promo Copy [Level 3]
Interesting thread...I'm seeing a lot of bootlegging on plain labels of some of this old stuff from the late 70's. I think bootlegging is justified, if you can't get it any other way. This old stuff should be repressed.
Acetate [Level 1]
Regarding Larry Levan's mixing:
You have to bear in mind that this guy was using crap turntables, not technics or anything and was mixing tracks that were not produced to be mixed and had dramatically different tempos. As a result, and bearing in mind that he was a pioneer of mixing, you have to give him credit for effectively "creating" club DJing as it is today.
If you have tried mixing disco yourself you will notice that it is very hard to keep the beats in time as they are not at a constant bpm either. The beat is controlled by a human drummer, not a drum machine so there is naturally fluctuation in the tempo. Mixing 2 tracks that do this is very difficult and constant adjustment is required. With a lot of practice, I have managed to do it so it sounds reasonable at best. Mixing house is MUCH easier.
Technically, the Larry Levan mix from the Paradise garage is not great by modern standards, but the programming, the "way" he plays these records and the order in which he plays them, is inspirational.
Regarding current Disco mixed cd's:
Derrick Carter has just released a really good mix cd of old disco stuff on the Azuli label called "Choice". Francois K and Tony Humphries have also released"Choice" cd's. These are really good mixes of old school house, funk and disco and i would recommend them.
Others to watch out for are the Francois K "essential" CD, the Unabombers "Saturday Night, Sunday Morning" CD, and Dimitri From Paris's "Night At The Playboy Mansion Vol 1".
Acetate [Level 1]
OK, here is my offering. 2 CD's (remixed 3:00 per song avg.) of non stop disco dance classics. Added sound effects and song bits & pieces. Lucky if you sit down more than two songs. Anyway, these CD's truly capture what i remember from back in the day. Heart stomping, master mixing and great selection.
Virtually There CD1
01) Stratavarious - I Got Your Love
02) Vicki Sue Robinson - Turn The Beat Around
03) Evelyn Champagne King - Shame
04) Ring The - Savage Lover
05) Kat Mandu - The Break
06) Lime - Come And Get Your Love
07) Shake your Groove Thang
08) Paul Jabara - Honeymoon In Puerto Rico
09) Barry White - My First, My Last, My Everything
10) Arpeggio - Love and desire
11) USA-European Connection - Come Into My Heart
12) Amant - If There's Love
13) Miquel Brown - So Many Men So Little Time
14) Voyage - From East To West
15) Giorgio Moroder - From Here To Eternity
16) Pattie Brooks - After Dark
17) Isley Brothers - Who's That Lady
18) Voyage - Souvenirs
19) South Shore Commission - Free Man
20) O'Jays - I Love Music
21) Harold Melvin & The Blue Notes - Where Are All My Friends
22) Linda Clifford - If My Friends Could See Me Now
23) Gary's Gang - Keep On Dancing
24) Kano - I'm Ready
25) Tavares - Dont take away the music
26) Love and Kisses - I Found Love (Now That I Found You)
27) Reflections - Three Steps From True Love
28) Alec Costandinos - Romeo & Juliet
Virtually There CD2
01) Sparks - Beat The Clock
02) Joneses - Sugar Pie Guy
03) Blue Magic - Look Me Up
04) Ultra Nate - Desire
05) Mighty Clouds Of Joy - Tme
06) A Taste Of Honey - Boogie Oogie Oogie
07) Tempest Trio - Love Machine
08) Main Ingredient - Happiness Is Just Around The Bend
09) Salsoul Orchestra - Ooh I Love It
10) Cory Daye - Pow Wow
11) Salsoul Orchestra - Salsoul Hustle
12) Gene Page - Love Starts After Dark
13) GQ - Disco Nights
14) Salsoul Orchestra - Tangerine
15) Tavares - It Only Takes A Minute
16) Carol Jiani - Ask Me
17) Yambu - Sunny
18) Janice McClain - Smack Dab In The Middle
19) Trammps - Zing Went The Strings Of My Heart
20) Trammps - That's Where The Happy People Go
21) Teddy Pendergrass - The More I Get The More I Want
22) Barrabas - Woman
23) Softones - That Old Black Magic
24) Ritchie Family - The Best Disco In Town
Double Platinum Record [Level 9]
Excuse me? Where are you getting this information :o ? If any of us were using 'crap' turntables it was those of us working the smaller venues. Paradise Garage gave Larry everything he asked for. He helped design the system. If Larry didn't have his say on what was in the booth, he would threaten not to play. Please, I don't think he was asking for or using crap.
As were all of us at the time. It was no big deal. That's the way music was made and we learned how to play it. We didn't expect perfect tempos because there was no such thing. Beat mixing today is no thrill. Try it with some real music.and was mixing tracks that were not produced to be mixed and had dramatically different tempos.
And now we've really reached the fork in the road. Larry, a pioneer of mixing? Larry, creating club DJ'ing? :roll: I don't think so! There were too many before him to give him these credits. Larry gained fame, true, when the importance of the DJ in the club was finally recognized. But in the beginnings, he was running and funning around with the rest of us, taking time to listen to as many other established DJ's as he could. Because of his friendships with Nicky Siano and Frankie Knuckles he got to know and hear a lot. Siano trained Larry! How many times does this have to be said before people begin to lower this pedestal they've got him on?As a result, and bearing in mind that he was a pioneer of mixing, you have to give him credit for effectively "creating" club DJing as it is today.
I already addressed this. Like I said, it was, and still is, no big deal. Difficult to a generation who didn't have to do it perhaps (and we've talked about this on the board) but not for those who were there.If you have tried mixing disco yourself you will notice that it is very hard to keep the beats in time as they are not at a constant bpm either. The beat is controlled by a human drummer, not a drum machine so there is naturally fluctuation in the tempo. Mixing 2 tracks that do this is very difficult and constant adjustment is required. With a lot of practice, I have managed to do it so it sounds reasonable at best. Mixing house is MUCH easier.
These are the same props normally given to David Mancuso of The Loft, and deservedly so. Why? Because David never aspired to beat-match his music. He always let the music speak for itself. If Larry is to be 'the god' behind the turntables, then (IMO) he can't be 'inspirational' without having the tech skills. Other DJ's were held to that standard. So he should be, too.Technically, the Larry Levan mix from the Paradise garage is not great by modern standards, but the programming, the "way" he plays these records and the order in which he plays them, is inspirational.
Here are a few "inpirational pioneers" who could mix:
Bobby "DJ" Guttadaro
Richie Kaczor
Roy Thode
Tee Scott
Richie Rivera
Tom Savarese
Nicky Siano
Jimmy Stuard
Larry Sanders
Eddie Rivera
John Luongo
Walter Gibbons
Larry Patterson
Larry Rossiello
Chart Hit [Level 6]
Quote:
"It was no big deal. That's the way music was made and we learned how to play it. We didn't expect perfect tempos because there was no such thing. Beat mixing today is no thrill. Try it with some real music."
Agreed.It probably is a bitch for the new generation as a majority of the music today maintains a constant BPM as opposed to fluctuations in the tempo created with real muscians and their instruments.Nicknack's got it right.It was no big deal for us old DJ's who evolved with the music.The real test was in the ability for a DJ to select the the appropiate tune that would mix in and retain the tempo and mood on the floor or elevating it to a higher level.We all got our high from pulling that off.
Different eyes see different things. Different hearts beat on different strings. But there are times for you and me when all such things agree...Rush
Triple Platinum Record [Level 10]
It's always tres amusant ("very amusing" to the non-Frenchies :lol: ) to me, whenever I hear today's "DJ" complaining "how hard it is to mix the old classic disco"!!!
DUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUH!!!!!
Yeah, it was HARD--and that's why not EVERYONE could do it, unlike today. You had to practice this stuff and practice and practice and even then many, myself included, wouldn't dare attempt it in public. IT WAS HARD!!!! Only the BEST were able to to it for a living. That's why we revered them. :D
Today, any kid can mix pre-fabricated beats together. It's easy. And yet, today the DJ is revered as a "SUPERSTAR"!!!
All they do is cut and paste and
"deconstruct" previously interesting tracks into boring, unlistenable mush. :evil:
"Lost inside adorable illusion...."
Underground Hit [Level 5]
Reading Lardarz response really emphasizes the lack of understanding among newer disco enthusiasts today of what was going on back in the late 1970's. To say that the 12's singles produced back then were not produced to be mixed??? The whole reason 12" singles existed was for them to be mixed. This response epitomizes that, the whole aspect of mixing has been lost among todays DJ's. It is so sad....and so sad that there is so few of us left that remember how it used to be...You have to bear in mind that this guy was using crap turntables, not technics or anything and was mixing tracks that were not produced to be mixed and had dramatically different tempos.
To listen to all this techno **** in today's clubs; and to think these DJ's think mixing this stuff is talent?
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