Have You Tried Remixing Software?

[normvork]

I have been reading about remixing software and was wondering if anybody here has experimented with it. Apparently you can do all sorts of fantastic manipulations to recordings...remove the vocals to get instrumental passages, add additional percussion, overlay synthesizer loops, and mix the whole thing around by electronic splicing. It seems about the only thing you can't do is get an acapella pulled out from the mix of a song.

Have any of you guys messed around with this software? Sounds like a lot of fun. Also would be great for finally making one's own long versions of too-short tracks that never got an extended mix release. I also imagine taking some non-disco pop tunes and making them into disco or hi NRG remixes.

Anyone care to make reccomendations for product choices?

[Disco Funk]

I have been reading about remixing software and was wondering if anybody here has experimented with it. Apparently you can do all sorts of fantastic manipulations to recordings...remove the vocals to get instrumental passages,

Is there really software out there that can remove just the vocals? I assumed the only way to do that was the use a technique where you paste the invert of one channel over the other channel, resulting in a mono track where the common, middle area of the recording is remove. The middle is usually where the vocals are mixed, but that's also where the drums and bass are mixed. I'd love to know if there was software out there that can remove vocals but preserve the stereo separation as well as the drums and bass.

Disco Funk

[BrunoRepublic]

Is there really software out there that can remove just the vocals? I assumed the only way to do that was the use a technique where you paste the invert of one channel over the other channel, resulting in a mono track where the common, middle area of the recording is remove. The middle is usually where the vocals are mixed, but that's also where the drums and bass are mixed. I'd love to know if there was software out there that can remove vocals but preserve the stereo separation as well as the drums and bass.

Disco Funk

Adobe Audition has a center channel filter that can do the same trick but leave the remainder in stereo, however it leaves noticeable artifacts and of course also kills anything else that's panned center.

Please, let's not use the term "remix" here, since without access to the multi-track masters, it is not possible to re-mix anything. All that is being done is editing and putting additional material on top. And while apps like Logic Pro make that quite easy (perhaps too easy), people have been doing it for ages.

[needlefingers]

If you are interested in begining, and don't want to spend a lot of money, you might want to try the UMIXIT audio CD's.

UMIXIT is a cutdown version of Cakewalk. You pay a couple of dollars more for a UMIXIT CD, but the software is in the package. For 20 dollars more, that you pay online, you get a more expanded version(up to 64 tracks and more effects).

UMIXIT CD's break it down to 8 - 16 tracks, breaking up vocals, back-up vocals, bass, percussion, lead quitar,.....etc. In effect, you can remix and/or add other beats, sounds, vocals,...etc. You can also use it to record lp's into your computer.

UMIXIT CD's out there include the last Aerosmith and U2 lp's, Bob Sinclair's Love Generation, Kristine W's I'll Be You Light and others. Look that it says UMIXIT on the package.

But I agree, you can't remove vocals without losing out or level dropping of other frequencies. (With UMIXIT CD's you can, because vocals are a seperate track)

It's a good and very inexpensive way to begin if you have an interest in audio editing and remixing(total investment, with $20 online upgrade, $25-30). Tons cheaper than Logic, CuBase, Pro-Tools or any of the other professional or even semi-pro, consumer friendly software programs.

[normvork]

Okay, so if what I want to do is to take out vocals to make an instrumental passage, I may lose some other stuff too. If I lose some of the percussion I would suppose I could put a substitute drum loop in to "replace" what was lost, maybe?
Let me create a two real scenarios and then you guys suggest if it can be done, and how to do it.
1.) I have a vinyl copy of Freedom to Express Yourself by Denise La Salle. It's short and I want to create an extended version. There are clicks and pops to be removed. There are no instrumental interludes or rhythm breaks in this song. I want to rework the song by taking a long sample of the melody, remove the vocals from that sample and insert that new "instrumental" into the middle of the song. Then put back in some kind of a drum loop if the drums got too compromised by vocal removal process.
Is this possible? What software would I use?
2.) I have a copy on vinyl of I've Had It by Fanny, a girl-group rock tune from 1974. I think adding some hi NRG synthesizer loops over into the background could make it really fun. The drums are dancey but could use some more "disco" steady Boom-Boom added to the mix. What do you think? Is there software to help me with this?

[discokicks]

Okay, so if what I want to do is to take out vocals to make an instrumental passage, I may lose some other stuff too. If I lose some of the percussion I would suppose I could put a substitute drum loop in to "replace" what was lost, maybe?

What do you think? Is there software to help me with this?

I've been using Sound Forge. At first I was a bit intimidated by it, but once I caught on, I loved it! I needed something to correct and shorten the tedious mixes of today's dance music plus take out the floor-clearing drop-outs (exactly what does one do on the dancefloor when the beat and music totally disappear then quietly builds for two minutes? :icon_confused: )

I haven't used the audio restoration tools on it but they're there (I use Diamond Cut Audio for that). If I want to eliminate a section of the song, I first of all copy the section right after it and then paste it at the start of the part I want omitted. If you want to extend a break, you copy that section and paste it after it. Of course it's not quite that simple as you need to manipulate the cursor for a smooth splice....so it's paste, listen, undo, move cursor (by one-thousandth of a second if you want), paste, listen, undo, etc.....just like we used to do with a cassette tape player!

There might be easier tricks within Sound Forge that I haven't discovered yet but I'm still learning (it keeps me busy and out of trouble :icon_lol: ) I'm not sure if it removes vocals very well though.

[thommy2458]

Adobe Audition has a center channel filter that can do the same trick but leave the remainder in stereo, however it leaves noticeable artifacts and of course also kills anything else that's panned center.

Please, let's not use the term "remix" here, since without access to the multi-track masters, it is not possible to re-mix anything. All that is being done is editing and putting additional material on top. And while apps like Logic Pro make that quite easy (perhaps too easy), people have been doing it for ages.

Graham-Have you used Logic Pro? The last time
I tried fooling around with this stuff I was using
something called DJ Pro tools(I think?) When
my old computor crashed I never re-installed
the software.That was at least 4 years ago,so I'm wondering what the easiest program to look into if I wanted to try again.Thanks
Thom

[BrunoRepublic]

Graham-Have you used Logic Pro?

Yes, it's my main music-making application and the reason why I got a Mac . Apple killed the Windows version when they bought eMagic, and it's such a deep, powerful, and complicated application that it was easier for me to learn OS X and shell out for a Mac rather than learn Cubase or Ableton Live on Windows.

[normvork]

Okay, so if what I want to do is to take out vocals to make an instrumental passage, I may lose some other stuff too. If I lose some of the percussion I would suppose I could put a substitute drum loop in to "replace" what was lost, maybe?
Let me create a two real scenarios and then you guys suggest if it can be done, and how to do it.
1.) I have a vinyl copy of Freedom to Express Yourself by Denise La Salle. It's short and I want to create an extended version. There are clicks and pops to be removed. There are no instrumental interludes or rhythm breaks in this song. I want to rework the song by taking a long sample of the melody, remove the vocals from that sample and insert that new "instrumental" into the middle of the song. Then put back in some kind of a drum loop if the drums got too compromised by vocal removal process.
Is this possible? What software would I use?
2.) I have a copy on vinyl of I've Had It by Fanny, a girl-group rock tune from 1974. I think adding some hi NRG synthesizer loops over into the background could make it really fun. The drums are dancey but could use some more "disco" steady Boom-Boom added to the mix. What do you think? Is there software to help me with this?

I hope to be upgrading in summer of 2007 to a new computer but it will be a windows system. Looking at what I hope to be able to do, should I invest in an Acid Product, Sound Forge or some other product?

[Energyguy]

Can anyone tell me if the software by MAJIX is any good ?? I am thinking of buying one of their MUSIC STUDIO packages so I can start creating my own dance music..

[BrunoRepublic]

Can anyone tell me if the software by MAJIX is any good ?? I am thinking of buying one of their MUSIC STUDIO packages so I can start creating my own dance music..

If you're referring to Magix, it's not widely regarded as a serious music production tool. Then again, the price is quite affordable.

I hope they've been able to update it... it was originally based on Logic 4, but that ended when Apple bought eMagic back in 2002.

[thommy2458]

I guess I still have the same question as
Norm-what audio software is affordable and
simple for doing edit's only? I don't want to
produce new music just make clean edits
of older tracks without spending more than
100 dollars.Anyone? Norm,have you decided
on anything yet?

Thom

[Energyguy]

If you're referring to Magix, it's not widely regarded as a serious music production tool. Then again, the price is quite affordable.

I hope they've been able to update it... it was originally based on Logic 4, but that ended when Apple bought eMagic back in 2002.

Thank you. I may shop around.

[BrunoRepublic]

I guess I still have the same question as
Norm-what audio software is affordable and
simple for doing edit's only? I don't want to
produce new music just make clean edits
of older tracks without spending more than
100 dollars.Anyone? Norm,have you decided
on anything yet?

Thom

Audacity is free.

[thommy2458]

Audacity is free.

Thanks Graham-I'm going to try this and see
if I like it.

Thom

[normvork]

I guess I still have the same question as
Norm-what audio software is affordable and
simple for doing edit's only? I don't want to
produce new music just make clean edits
of older tracks without spending more than
100 dollars.Anyone? Norm,have you decided
on anything yet?

Thom

Thom,
I am going to try Sonic Foundry Acid Music 2.0. It has a beat mapping tool (which I don't think Audacity has.)
This tool helps to get those overdubs lined up in synch, which supposedly relieves lots of headaches when you are mixing a track with a live recording of a human drummer.
I got it for under $10.00 on ebay and it will work on my windows 98 computer. If I like it I can buy a newer version for $60-$70 called Acid Studio 6.0 which I would want to wait for, since my current computer is over 7 years old and is not fast enough nor enough hard drive space for the new version. A good book to introduce yourself to this topic is called Burning Down The House by Elliot Van Buskirk. Usually a cheap copy available at Amazon.com.
I really want to try Sound Forge but no cheap copies found yet.
I also will probably try Audacity. It's free and it can do a lot. From my reading it makes sense to have both softwares.

[thommy2458]

If I like it I can buy a newer version for $60-$70 called Acid Studio 6.0 which I would want to wait for, since my current computer is over 7 years old and is not fast enough nor enough hard drive space for the new version. A good book to introduce yourself to this topic is called Burning Down The House by Elliot Van Buskirk. Usually a cheap copy available at Amazon.com.
I really want to try Sound Forge but no cheap copies found yet.
I also will probably try Audacity. It's free and it can do a lot. From my reading it makes sense to have both softwares.

Thanks Norm-this is a big help.So if I have a new computor with Windows XP I 'm guessing
the Acid Studio might work for me.Norm,if you have time,can you keep us posted how this worked out for you?Thanks Thom

[normvork]

Thanks Norm-this is a big help.So if I have a new computor with Windows XP I 'm guessing
the Acid Studio might work for me.Norm,if you have time,can you keep us posted how this worked out for you?Thanks Thom

Will get right on it as soon as the software gets here. The song Mr. Postman is going through my head. I wonder if Karen Carpenter could be set to disco.

[normvork]

DO NOT BUY ACID 2.0!
I did not know that the beat mapping tool was not added until version 3.0.
Withuout beatmapper, 2.0 is useless for remixing. You can create some interesting compositions in a range of genres, especially house music or new age background ambient music very easily. But if you load a prerecorded music track onto 2.0 you can not make it fit into the rhythms they set up for you on the program's grid. The acid 2.0 program arrived and within half an hour I had made a pretty fun background track for something danceable. But you gotta get the lead vocals into the mix. Singing is not my forte, but if it was I'd be having lots of fun making original music right now.
Anyhow, Acid Music 3.0, 4.0 and Acid Studio 6 all have the beatmapper.
Beatmapper automatically figures out where the beats are in a song you import and lets you correct it if it screws up a little. Beatmapper aligns all the overlaying sound and loops (which you would apply) over your "remix" tune so the extra drums and basslines will fit properly. At least this is how it should work.
I'll find out when the next postal delivery comes around with my 3.0 version. In the meantime I have to score a newer computer with 400Mhz operating speed cuz I'm living with a windows 98 computer @ 267Mhz. Version 3.0 requires more speed than I now have.

As for Audacity, I downloaded it this afternoon. Have to do some self education to figure out what to do with it. The nice thing about Acid is that it comes with lots of loops. Audacity needs to have you get your own, as far as I can tell.

[normvork]

Please, let's not use the term "remix" here, since without access to the multi-track masters, it is not possible to re-mix anything. All that is being done is editing and putting additional material on top.

Sorry Graham, but I use the word "Remix" for lack of a concise alternative term. Should I call it an "Overmix" or "overdub" or "pc reedit" or what? The end product which I am seeking to create most closely resembles what I have known as a "remix."

[BrunoRepublic]

Sorry Graham, but I use the word "Remix" for lack of a concise alternative term. Should I call it an "Overmix" or "overdub" or "pc reedit" or what? The end product which I am seeking to create most closely resembles what I have known as a "remix."

Re-edit, fanmix, mash-up, whatever... but unless you've got the original multitracks in your hands, it's not a true remix. :)

[K-Bee]

Whatever you may call the finished product mix, remix or whatever, there's no doubt in my mind that the combination of Audacity and Acid Pro is a winning one. I've been using various versions of these two applications since 2001 and they get by warmest recommendation.
And don't forget, it's all a matter of having a good ear really, if you don't understand the basics of music (bars, measures, keys and all that), it doesn't matter what equipment you use. The result will be crap!

[normvork]

Whatever you may call the finished product mix, remix or whatever, there's no doubt in my mind that the combination of Audacity and Acid Pro is a winning one. I've been using various versions of these two applications since 2001 and they get by warmest recommendation.
And don't forget, it's all a matter of having a good ear really, if you don't understand the basics of music (bars, measures, keys and all that), it doesn't matter what equipment you use. The result will be crap!

Is there a resouce to determine what key a song is recorded in, or do I just go by ear? I remember BITD seeing an ad for a book listing keys for DJ.s to mix by. Is there anything online these days?

[K-Bee]

I'm not aware of any resources letting you know what key a certain song is recorded in. The easiest thing is to have a musical instrument nearby and go from there I guess

[QUINNY]

I'm not aware of any resources letting you know what key a certain song is recorded in. The easiest thing is to have a musical instrument nearby and go from there I guess

KBee: I think you need to come out of the closet and tell us more about NJS4E. So when you used to post your love for Disco music.....you were just usin' us, teasin' us, what?

As for Audacity and simple editing. It is perfect for doing this and quite frankly I'm amazed (and worried) that a free audio editing software can do tasks that would have been 'professional only' just a few years ago. One annoying thing is its inability to scrub or playback at a slower speed without having to change tempo and then undo....which means it is fiddly to get the exact edit point. So far as I can determine it doesn't allow markers to be set up neither, so you have to be very much 'on the ball' to suss out the exact spot for editing once you've 'artificially scrubbed to the point' and undone it again, as the screen tends to skip places if you're not very careful.

All in all Audacity is bloomin' marvellous, BUT terribly, terribly tiresome.