Better Than The Original

[originalbigm]

Was listening to Jackie Moore's version of "This Time Baby" to-day when it made me think that this took the original, that was done by The O'jays a few years earlier,to a new and greater level.I'm sure there are other such examples such as Thelma Houston's "Don't Leave Me This Way" done originally by Teddy Pendergrass and The Bluenotes.I am not refering to standards that were converted to disco formats.Any others come to mind?

[QUINNY]

I'll be hung for this, but I thought Eddie & THe Soul Boys 'Shaft' was a much better dancer than the original,
also Destination's 'Move On Up' was a much better dancer than Curtis Mayfield's original (I played the hell out of Mayfield's back in the day and loved it, but....).
Afrique's 'Soul Makossa' was so much better than Manu Dibango's original (loved and played both).
Dare I say, Joe Battaan's 'The Bottle/La Botella' was the definitive Disco version of Gil Scott- Heron original (even Brother to Brother's version was played more than the Gil Scott-Heron one at the time too).

[NickNack]

I always slide back-and-forth between Bobby Womack's original "I Can Understand It" and New Birth's cover. Most of the time I go for New Birth.

On the other hand, as good as Sylvester was, "Lovin' Is Really My Game" will always belong to Brainstorm and "Most of All" by Gloria Gaynor beats St. Tropez's cover.

I sometimes prefer the vocal cover of "Love's Theme" by Love Unlimited over the instrumental by LUO. Eddine Kendrick's "Date With the Rain" is a classic but Arnie's Love has a better dance version in it's cover.

Lastly, I like Martin Steven's cover of "Love Is In the Air" over John Paul Young's ONLY because I heard it first.

_________________
If It Don't Mean a Thing, Would You Dance to My Music
Nicky

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: NickNack on 2002-10-02 20:01 ]</font>

[NickNack]

Wait!! Can't forget Marlena Shaw's "Touch Me In the Morning" over Ms. Ross. Or for that matter, the instrumental cover by MFSB over Ms. Ross.

BTW, who did "Hijack" first --- Herbie Mann or Barrabas? I like Barrabas.

_________________
If It Don't Mean a Thing, Would You Dance to My Music
Nicky

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: NickNack on 2002-10-02 20:03 ]</font>

[Funky Dude]

There's a lot of titles to talk about here but I'll talk about a few. In regards to what's better than the original here's some to mention:

La Belle Epoque - Black Is Black 1977 (Originally done in the late 60's by a soul/R&B group, I've forgotten the name of the artist but anyway I like both versions but La Belle's is by far better especially the long 14 minute version as it's got all of the synthesizer and percussion work which makes it BRILLIANT!!!)

Van McCoy - Get Dancin' 1975 (It's a bit of a toss up between the original Discotex & The Sex-o-lettes and Van McCoy's version as they both sound great. Discotex's version goes for 7 minutes and Van McCoy's 3-4 minute version has a really cool funky Moog synthesizer wah wah sound. I'll go for Van McCoy's funky synthesizer version although Discotex's comes a close second place.)

Frankie Avalon - Venus (Disco Version) 1976 (Even better than his original 50's version)

Bobby Rydel - Sway (Disco Version) 1976 (Same thing, better than his original 50's version)

Van McCoy - Proud Mary 1974 (CCR's version is good but Van McCoy's disco version is even better)

Amii Stewart - Light My Fire 1979 (I like the Doors's original psychedelic version but as I'm a big lover of disco I'll go for Amii Stewart's version)

[DanceMan]

On 2002-10-02 19:57, NickNack wrote:

On the other hand, as good as Sylvester was, "Lovin' Is Really My Game" will always belong to Brainstorm and "Most of All" by Gloria Gaynor beats St. Tropez's cover.

Ditto on both of those big time.....certain songs should have never been covered and as much as I adored Sylvester, he had his own classics that nobody should touch either.

I sometimes prefer the vocal cover of "Love's Theme" by Love Unlimited over the instrumental by LUO. Eddine Kendrick's "Date With the Rain" is a classic but Arnie's Love has a better dance version in it's cover.

I remember that version from their 1974 album which is impossible to find....I loved it alot too, NN, wish I could find it.

Lastly, I like Martin Steven's cover of "Love Is In the Air" over John Paul Young's ONLY because I heard it first.

NickNack, what did you think of Jay Black's version on Millenium? just curious...(was it even a CONTENDA??!!)

[BrunoRepublic]

On 2002-10-02 19:57, NickNack wrote:

Lastly, I like Martin Steven's cover of "Love Is In the Air" over John Paul Young's ONLY because I heard it first.

I think this is the version that I'm looking for... would you happen to know what label it's on?

Personally, I think the ultimate disco "way better than the original" song has to be Donna Summer's MacArthur Park. Who like the Richard Harris version anyway? From crooning cheese to a disco tour-de-force. Brilliant!

[DanceMan]

On 2002-10-02 21:14, Graham Start wrote:

On 2002-10-02 19:57, NickNack wrote:

Lastly, I like Martin Steven's cover of "Love Is In the Air" over John Paul Young's ONLY because I heard it first.

I think this is the version that I'm looking for... would you happen to know what label it's on?

Personally, I think the ultimate disco "way better than the original" song has to be Donna Summer's MacArthur Park. Who like the Richard Harris version anyway? From crooning cheese to a disco tour-de-force. Brilliant!

The Martin Steven version was on CBS - it is on a light pink label if you are looking for the original.....

I liked the piano break in Richard Harris' (NOW) but as a youngster when that song was release was just TOO MUCH to handle..that was the first year I began actively recording the radio playlists and I always cringed when that song was still in the Number 2 slot.....of course, by the time Donna Summer got around to recording it, the song was just ripe - and maybe, so was I ?

[Funky Dude]

NickNack wrote:
BTW, who did "Hijack" first --- Herbie Mann or Barrabas? I like Barrabas.

From the info I read about these two versions Barrabas's version would have to be the first as it was released in 1974 whereas Herbie Mann's version came out in 1975.

[jazz_pilgrim]

The best example that I can think of is on the jazz side. I always thought that Willie Bobo's percussive latin-tinged version of "Always There" was better than the Ronnie Laws original. Not by much though, as I think that Ronnie Laws' "Pressure Sensitive" LP is a fine album.

Maybe because Willie's version was so danceable, with that killer bass hook!

Another good example is Blue Magic's version of "Just Don't Want To Be Lonely", originally done by the Main Ingredient. Touch and go, once again IMHO, but I think the Blue Magic version just pips the Main Ingredient version.

[zeca azevedo]

On 2002-10-02 18:57, QUINNY wrote:
also Destination's 'Move On Up' was a much better dancer than Curtis Mayfield's original (I played the hell out of Mayfield's back in the day and loved it, but....).

Hey Quinny,

you're kidding, right?

zeca azevedo, the original

[zeca azevedo]

On 2002-10-02 21:05, Funky Dude wrote:
Van McCoy - Proud Mary 1974 (CCR's version is good but Van McCoy's disco version is even better)

Amii Stewart - Light My Fire 1979 (I like the Doors's original psychedelic version but as I'm a big lover of disco I'll go for Amii Stewart's version)

Hey Funky,

you're kidding, right?

zeca azevedo, the one and only

[zeca azevedo]

Let me tell you what I think about this topic: to find a cover version which is better than the original is like finding a needle in a haystack.

zeca azevedo, the needle in the haystack, baby

[markydefad]

Oh Zeca,

You took the words ("you've got to be kiding, right?") right outta my mouth...er...fingers!!! :grin:

BUT, sometimes the cover is excellent too--as with the Jackie Moore & Thelma Houston, right????

[zeca azevedo]

On 2002-10-03 13:28, markydefad wrote:
Oh Zeca,

BUT, sometimes the cover is excellent too--as with the Jackie Moore & Thelma Houston, right????

You're right Marky, there's some cover versions that sometimes are great as the original version. THELMA HOUSTON's DON'T LEAVE ME THIS WAY is good as HAROLD MELVIN's. There's other great cover versions, of course, but BETTER than the originals is difficult to find, at least for me. BTW, MacArthur Park with Richard Harris is a great record - and it is produced by the composer of the song, Jimmy Webb. A pop classic, for sure.

Peace,

zeca azevedo

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: zeca azevedo on 2002-10-03 14:41 ]</font>

[QUINNY]

Zeca: I kid you not! It all depends which context you apply. I said it "was a better dancer" if you remember. As this is a Disco music forum (1972 - 1987) then what I wrote is obviously true, no?

[markydefad]

Well, ya know, I think a case could be made for Curtis Mayfield's "Move on Up" being one of, if not THE FIRST DISCO RECORD ever (hey, this was released in 1970, is around 140 BPM (FAST!!!) and was 8:54 in length!!!!). "Shaft" was in 1971; Eddie Kendricks' "Girl You Need A Change Of Mind" in 1972--just a little food for thought.

Destination updated it to a more 1979 Disco sound--Both are worthy- BUT Mayfield's is the CLASSIC, IMHO!!!!

[originalbigm]

This was the point of my raising this subject.Finding a needle in a haystack is quite an accomplishment.Likewise redoing an original to be better is quite an accomplishment.There are definately some out there as mentioned previously but not a heck of a lot

[QUINNY]

Marky: Let's not start this 'When did Disco start' again. Otherwise I'd be forced to drag up the Jump and Jive Jukebox hits of the '40s like Louie Prima and Louis Jordan. They even made short promotional films that pre dated video promos by 30 years.
At 140 BPM Curtis is too fast and rather disjointed rhythm pattern to be considered typical Disco (even Destination was too fast for its day really). Even though I loved Curtis's original I'd still put Destination's in front for pure danceability.
'People Get Ready' by The Impressions was always my fave Curtis Mayfield track.

[NickNack]

On 2002-10-02 21:14, Graham Start wrote:

On 2002-10-02 19:57, NickNack wrote:

Lastly, I like Martin Steven's cover of "Love Is In the Air" over John Paul Young's ONLY because I heard it first.

I think this is the version that I'm looking for... would you happen to know what label it's on?

Hi Graham,

Here's the info off the 12" label:

1978 CBS Records Canada Ltd.
# 12C4-4187
Production: Michel Daigle et Dominic Sciscente pour Non Stop Productions

'Columbia' surrounds the outer label as is normal but the color shading is different from my US labels. More orange to the red. Maybe it was originally pink... don't really know.

What is wild is that I NEVER played the John Paul Young version until the late '80's or early 90's, when they remixed it again. Nobody seemed to miss it.

[NickNack]

On 2002-10-02 21:07, DanceMan wrote:

On 2002-10-02 19:57, NickNack wrote:
Lastly, I like Martin Steven's cover of "Love Is In the Air" over John Paul Young's ONLY because I heard it first.

NickNack, what did you think of Jay Black's version on Millenium? just curious...(was it even a CONTENDA??!!)

Actually, I liked his version and even tried to introduce it with the others. The dancefloor wouldn't have it. The other two were just too popular.

[zeca azevedo]

On 2002-10-03 14:45, QUINNY wrote:
Zeca: I kid you not! It all depends which context you apply. I said it "was a better dancer" if you remember. As this is a Disco music forum (1972 - 1987) then what I wrote is obviously true, no?

Hey Quinny,

I read perfectly what youwrote and I keep my opinion here. I can tell you, I've already played MOVE ON UP by Curtis on parties here in Brasil and the crowd danced... Maybe the guys in England find this track a hard one to follow on the dancefloor, who knows (LOL). For me, what you wrote is not OBVIOUSLY true, you know what I mean?

I agree with Marky here, CURTIS version IS the classic one. Destination's version is cool, but a bland one when you cmpare it with the original. If you prefer Destination's over Curtis' version to play at parties, that's YOUR choice, not the OBVIOUS choice, baby.

zeca azevedo, blowing against the wind

[jazz_pilgrim]

On 2002-10-04 08:42, zeca azevedo wrote:

I can tell you, I've already played MOVE ON UP by Curtis on parties here in Brasil and the crowd danced... Maybe the guys in England find this track a hard one to follow on the dancefloor, who knows (LOL).

Zeca,

I can happily that report that in the clubs I used to frequent in London and the South-East, Curtis Mayfield has always been a MASSIVELY popular dance track - right up until the late Eighties when I gave up clubbing!! I have always loved dancing to it!! :grin: :grin:

Indeed when I bought a CD player for my Fortieth birtday nearly 2 years ago, the first set of CDs I bought was a Curtis Mayfield box set :grin:

[QUINNY]

Blind Hero worship meets Northern Soul? A rather specialized type of club Jazz. Not yer average contemporary Disco, especially in 1980.

I loved Jimi Hendrix but I didn't force him on my paying customers. (This is where blind hero worship takes over) Mind you he was IMHO the most soulful musician to ever walk the earth. If you want proof just watch 'The Star Spangled Banner' performed at Woodstock. Every muscle and sinew, every nuance just oozed real soul. The guy was tortured and sublime at the same time. Talk about emotion!!!!

[jazz_pilgrim]

On 2002-10-04 09:31, QUINNY wrote:
Blind Hero worship meets Northern Soul? A rather specialized type of club Jazz. Not yer average contemporary Disco, especially in 1980.

(a) "Blind Hero worship?" :- No - a reasoned opinion that I have built up over 25 years.
It took me a long time to find all of Curtis's early Seventies politically-driven tunes, which I particularly enjoy....

(b) "Northern Soul? A rather specialized type of club Jazz." No - More like the southern Soul Mafia scene! At that time I was not into Northern Soul.

I don't need to categorize records - disco music to me is simply the records I used to hear at the discos I went to. As far I am concerned, this record was played at a good many clubs right across the South-East - places like the Caister Soul Weekenders, Brighton Top Rank All-Dayers, Canvey Island Goldmine, Dartford's Flicks, Isle of Sheppey and our own hangout - the Spring Tavern near Brands Hatch.

It was all very simple - The jocks played that record - we liked it - we danced to it. Period.