The devil came here yesterday

[paul]

My hero at the UN. :lol:

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/14923411/

[Videoskooter]

Paul, read this on your so worshipped Idol. And it isn't exactly a neo-conservative site.

http://hrw.org/doc/?t=americas&c=venezu

And a weblog from a Venezuelan=somebody who is actually living there and not somebody who is babbling in San Diegan pubs on how great Yugo is doing but probably has never been in the country itself :-)

http://daniel-venezuela.blogspot.com...economics.html

(On the other hand I'm really waisting my time now, coz' our links are always the bad ones)

[paul]

Paul, read this on your so worshipped Idol. And it isn't exactly a neo-conservative site.

http://hrw.org/doc/?t=americas&c=venezu

And a weblog from a Venezuelan=somebody who is actually living there and not somebody who is babbling in San Diegan pubs on how great Yugo is doing but probably has never been in the country itself :-)

http://daniel-venezuela.blogspot.com...economics.html

(On the other hand I'm really waisting my time now, coz' our links are always the bad ones)

Ouch...and I thought you loved me :lol:
I have stated a long while back that I don't like Chavez or anyone alse for that matter curtailing civil liberties. Unfortunately this idiot has lost the moral high the US had. How can you take a president seriously about civil liberties when he wages an illegal war, ignores the Geneva convention, do un-warranted spying on his own people, etc!
Yugo may not be perfect but at least he stands up to this clown and unlike the fake cowboy was popularly elected!

[paul]

Allow me to provide some background as to why Hugo called Bush the devil. The link below gives you a good background. It might also explain why some Cuban-Americans don't like Hugo.
A little bit of irony here as well. Note the date is April 2002. This around the time after 9/11 when many Americans asked, "Why do they hate us."

PS - Johan, if you'll notice, Human Rights Watch plays no political favorites. The US and Europe can be found there as well!

http://observer.guardian.co.uk/inter...688071,00.html

[Videoskooter]

http://www.cnn.com/2006/POLITICS/09/....ny/index.html

[paul]

Yes Johan, thanks for sharing that. I heard about this earlier today.
Pelosi's cowardice doesn't surprise me. She as a Democrat was critical of Howard Dean when he dared say we take a even-handed approach when dealing with Israel and Palestinians.
Rangel really surprises me :roll:

[DiscoMan]

Chavez is a dangerous idiot - just like Jimmy "Peanut Man" Carter.
The world will be a better place when someone puts a round through his squash.

[paul]

I see the typical knuckle-scraping neanderthal political commentary from you again DM. I'll give it all the thought it deserves.
Here's another take on the Venezualan free speech issue.

http://www.venezuelanalysis.com/articles.php?artno=1382

[Videoskooter]

Let's put it this way: If somebody came into my house and started ridiculising and insulting my family, my wife or me. If somebody would misuse our hospitality in such a rude and pathetic way...I.....you know :o

That man is a pozzo, a raving lunatic, a disgrace for his country, a retard and a stronzo!

Hugo, if you read this, enjoy the remaining days of your reign :o :lol:

Ooooh, I spot a real objective site here :-)

http://www.venezuelanalysis.com/ (sponsored by the Chavez family!)

[paul]

Sorry Johan, that site is the only news organization I found with a different report on free speech. I have heard from people who have been there that they do have free speech there but I can't link that 8)

Let's put it this way: If somebody came into my house and started ridiculising and insulting my family, my wife or me. If somebody would misuse our hospitality in such a rude and pathetic way...I.....you know

Chavez agrees with you. When Bush tried to have a coup and possibly have him killed in his own country, he...you know had every business calling bush the devil. Fortunately most of his countrymen want him and I'm sure he has more respect around the world than that petulant rhinestone cowboy!

Funny how a real populist, a man of the people is attacked by people who worshipped a figure who was also populist

Chavez is proving is desire to help the poor is more than just a stunt. Right On!

http://www.time.com/time/nation/arti...157172,00.html

[Videoskooter]

This is this year's report from Anesty International on Venezuela. Hugo is a great defender of human rights and this is only the beginning. Just like every other leftist so called friend of the people and helper of the poor, he will show his real face in the next months. Not years coz' he won't be there very long :lol:

http://web.amnesty.org/report2006/ven-summary-eng

Chavez is a pathetic Castro-wannabee and a real hypocrit. (Hey if he can say this on other people, I can say this on him too).

What's the difference between Chavez and a pig? Pigs don't wear barets!

[Mixmachine]

Yugo may not be perfect but at least he stands up to this clown and unlike the fake cowboy was popularly elected!

:p:p do you know what 'yugo ' means?? look it up :p:p

He's only in power because the rigged referendum was authenticated by a peanut farmer :lol::lol::lol: and a bad one at that :razz::razz:

Chavez is proving is desire to help the poor is more than just a stunt. Right On!

hahaha, yeah, just like Castro helped the poor of his prison island, never mind the poor of the world he promised to 'liberate', 2 millions cuban exiles wondering around the world, and three times that many yearning to escape.

Yugo is already 'causing a major exodus, come to Miami and see, Maybe you should move to Bolivia, Evo is going to re-write the constitution to abolish 'private property' , I'm sure this is your kind of town

[paul]

This is this year's report from Anesty International on Venezuela. Hugo is a great defender of human rights and this is only the beginning. Just like every other leftist so called friend of the people and helper of the poor, he will show his real face in the next months. Not years coz' he won't be there very long :lol:

http://web.amnesty.org/report2006/ven-summary-eng

Chavez is a pathetic Castro-wannabee and a real hypocrit. (Hey if he can say this on other people, I can say this on him too).

What's the difference between Chavez and a pig? Pigs don't wear barets!

I know you will never like Mr Chavez.
Johan, this post shows exactly why I feel you have a sort of narrow vision. The link you gave is fine. Note however that Amnesty has criticism for virtually every nation including the US and your country, Belgium. I suppose this doesn't matter cause you just hate Chavez.

[paul]

:p:p do you know what 'yugo ' means?? look it up :p:p

He's only in power because the rigged referendum was authenticated by a peanut farmer :lol::lol::lol: and a bad one at that :razz::razz:



hahaha, yeah, just like Castro helped the poor of his prison island, never mind the poor of the world he promised to 'liberate', 2 millions cuban exiles wondering around the world, and three times that many yearning to escape.

Yugo is already 'causing a major exodus, come to Miami and see, Maybe you should move to Bolivia, Evo is going to re-write the constitution to abolish 'private property' , I'm sure this is your kind of town

Rigged? What does Yugo mean? I prefer your definition.
Castro sadly morphed into the kind of despot he replaced. He did some good but I believe his ego got caught up the anti-castro attemps to kill him by this government and the Cuban exiles in South Florida.
The last I heard about this so called exodus, it was among the ruling class who can't believe the poor might actually have a shot at living at level above utter squalor and poverty.

[remicks]

*****

Has anyone pondered the good Castro might possibly have brought to Cuba had he been allowed to carry out his original goals and had the US not succeeded in doing everything possible to thwart them ? The odds of any success were highly stacked against him .... wouldn't you agree ?

As for Hugo ....sure everything he is saying about BUSH may indeed be true ...... but who cares about the insidious truth of all that !! Just don't dare to then call Bush ....( resounding loud reactionary gasps required ) THE DEVIL ( oooo ... such a bad word you used :p!!! ) .... because of it !!! :p...... :lol::lol::lol::lol:. The self-described rational thinking conservatives are actually quite sensitive you know .... & get very emotionally upset and slip into a blind rage from such schoolyard name calling. :lol::lol:

*****

[DiscoMan]

"Has anyone pondered the good Castro might possibly have brought to Cuba had he been allowed to carry out his original goals and had the US not succeeded in doing everything possible to thwart them ? The odds of any success were highly stacked against him .... wouldn't you agree ?"

Are you shittin' me!?

Remicks; you better go back to school...

[remicks]

*******

NO ... I ain't shittin' you .

Anybody else besides Discoman give any thought to how different the world might be if countries were allowed to determine their own destinies?? (and also .... therefore how the USA, in turn, wouldn't be hated so much ) ......

*****

[DiscoMan]

Remicks...go back to school.

[remicks]

*****

......maybe a little reprogramming to unquestioningly accept all that self-promoting US propagandist stuff such as the proclamation of our religious entitlement to a "manifest destiny" ???? ( Boy , wouldn't we be viewed as radical religious extremists if we reapplied that assertion today :???::icon_exclaim: )

Sorry DM, I caught on to all that the first time around!!!:razz::icon_sad:

[paul]

Can I post.

[paul]

Good, either Bernie had server problems or DM's secret police were monitoring my posts :-o
Anyway, I wanted to post that Pre-Castro Cuba was rife with coruuption as well as being in the grip of the mafia and similar tropical gangsters. Castro's government brought in a higher literacy rate, greater access to medical care, and the removal of the mafia's grip.
Perhaps Mix can add or correct what I posted here

[Videoskooter]

Good, either Bernie had server problems or DM's secret police were monitoring my posts

Paul, you are monitored but not by Bernie or Discoman.

[DiscoMan]

In God I trust... all others I monitor...:p

[Mixmachine]

Anyway, I wanted to post that Pre-Castro Cuba was rife with coruuption as well as being in the grip of the mafia and similar tropical gangsters. Castro's government brought in a higher literacy rate, greater access to medical care, and the removal of the mafia's grip.
Perhaps Mix can add or correct what I posted here

Nice baiting job, Paul. But I’m afraid you have watched to many leftist’s Hollywood movies. )(Godfather? Havana?)

I usually don’t debate Cuba issues any longer, what’s the use, especially since after 45+ years the irreparable damage has been done, and sadly IMO (and that of many ), is going to take several generations of Cubans (with luck) after Castro is gone to repair the damage inflicted.


I always marveled at how little understanding your average American has of what really happened in Cuba with Castro.:roll:

It seems like the American left (especially publications like the NY Times) was able to sell America a version of the events that became “facts” through the years (by repetition) despite all the contradicting evidence (maybe it will be corrected in the future):roll:

Yes, Batista and his cronies in the Army and police were out of control (not so much before Batista), but even so, under Batista life was infinite better for the great majority than under Castro by a long shot. Poverty and hunger will always be part of the Human landscape anywhere, but by far , even the poorest of Cubans, in general terms, never went hungry and/or begging in the streets (like many Latin American countries today), this image of Batista’s Cuba (or Cuba in general) is mostly bullshit.

Despite what the American left and the ‘useful fools’ of the world have fed the world (about the revolution), the Cuban revolution had nothing to do with poverty, discrimination or hunger, the poor class never revolted like they did during the French or Russian revolutions.

The Cuban revolution was a ‘middle class’ revolution, Castro’s families and most of those around him including his supporters were mostly wealthy middleclass, for instance, the only reason Castro after his captured was able to avoid execution was because of his family’s political connections with the Church and government, I’m sure their money came very handy too, if he had been an average Joe, we wouldn’t be here discussing the issue.

The middle class supported Castro because they wanted to get rid of Batista since he was an illegitimate corrupt President ( hurting the economy) that disrupted the progress of Democracy in conjunction with the army, not because they were Socialist much less Communists, certainly not because the “poor” revolted around the country.

Once Castro consolidated his control, he betrayed everyone and executed, eliminated, and/or jailed (for 30 years in cases) almost all those around him including many that fought with him in the mountains (because they hated communism and they rebelled and took up arms against him); Castro even sent the scum of Che Guevara packing to Bolivia when he got to cocky and/or popular in some circles (reportedly to a certain death) , then Castro declared himself communist (more interested in Castrism) and re-invented the revolution ( along the Bolsheviks’ line) and sold this image of the ‘savior’ of the Cuban oppressed masses to the ‘useful fools’ of the world who through the left media promptly romanticized and disseminated this fairy tale around the world, The New York Times is greatly responsible for this..

Pre-Castro’s Cuba per capita income when compared with all of Latin American /Caribbean economies at the time was second only to Argentina, the numbers even ranked up there with the USA, I've read that the Cuban peso occasionally even surpassed the US dollar in market value, Cubans produced everything they needed to feed themselves and then some, today , Cuba even imports Sugar, which had always been Cuba’s biggest exporting commodity.

Rent or buy Andy Garcia’s “The Lost city” and listen to the commentary, lots of historical facts discussed there, this movie is even handed in the treatment of the subject, and accurately depicts many of the facts, (not to every cuban liking though)for instance, Castro’s movement was not the only one fighting Batista, Castro just became better known and then took credit for other’s actions while he crushed them at the same time.
Take a look at this fact clip published a few years back in the Miami Herald.

[paul]

The baiting worked didn't it and I learned a few things :lol: