Plasma TV vs LCD. Which to Buy?

[paul]

Any of you have one and or would like to share your thoughts on this?
Within the next year I plan on buying a 42 to 50 inch flat panel TV. I'm 80% leaning toward Plasma. The Sony 46 inch LCD looks good but I noticed some minor flickering on strong black images.
I like the Pioneer plasmas. They looked better to me than the Panasonics and they have some hard core technology operating there sets. Of course the Pioneers run just over 50% more than most others including the Panasonics. Recently I caught a Samsung and it looked the best overall while being less expensive than the Pioneer.
Other issues include, few of these plasmas offer true HD resolution (1080i). LCDs do. There is also supposed to be a new flat screen on the market next year, SED. Anyway, any and all thoughts welcome. 8-)

[K-Bee]

I'd probably go for a LCD TV instead of a plasma one. I have a friend working in a TV/radio store over here, and he told me that if a plasma TV breaks, you have no option but to get a new one (if it's a screen problem that is). Accordig to my friend, LCD TV's do not suffer from that problem.
In general, reviews for the Samsung LCD TV's have been favorable. I'd probably go for those if buying a new TV at the moment.

[Bernie]

Paul,

I've sold both and the plasma TV especially the Pioneer Elite wins hands down for image quality. Here's a quick rundown for those who are in the market for a new high definition TV.

Plasma
Pros: Best image quality and very film-like with a great sense of depth and black levels with more detail in the dark and shadow areas of the picture. Greater palette of colors with a more natural look.
Cons: Generally more expensive, but prices have come down dramatically. Possibility of screen burn-in if a static image is left on the screen for long periods of time, but generally not a concern under normal use. Not suitable for brightly lit rooms or where you may have a lot of sunlight.

LCD
Pros: Essentially a large computer monitor so they are more robust and have greater light output so they do better in a room with lots of ambient light. this is really the only reason to buy an LCD.
Cons: Image is very flat and artificial looking. Motion artifacts when watching sports appear as stuttering as if watching an internet stream. Black levels are not as dark and vibrant as a plasma.

If you are an avid film and sports buff then a plasma is the way to go. If on the other hand you are more into video games or want a set for use in a room with a lot of sunlight then an LCD is a better choice.

The Pioneer Elite plasmas are just downright gorgeous, but very expensive. Worth every penny and the new 1080p models have come out, but are around $9,000(US).

If the Pioneer is too rich for your budget then take a look at the Samsung 4253 or5053 series of plasma TVs. The 42" can be had for just under $2,000 and looks absolutely amazing for its price and I was never a fan of Samsung products until now. Almost everyone I have shown the Smsungs to has bought it unless they had the bucks for the Pioneer Elite.

The plasma sets have been subject to a lot of misinformation (most of it planted by rival LCD and DLP manufacturers) that plasmas burn out after two years and get this: that the gas inside has to be recharged every so often! All of this is totally untrue, but many people believe this.

Hope that helps.

[paul]

Thanks all.
Bernie, I was looking at the Pioneer Elite 42". Do you know if they'll be coming out with or do they have that size with 1080i resolution? Is 1080i worth it?

[Bernie]

Thanks all.
Bernie, I was looking at the Pioneer Elite 42". Do you know if they'll be coming out with or do they have that size with 1080i resolution? Is 1080i worth it?

All plasma televisions till just very recently were 1080i (i standing for interlaced which is not as good as p for progressive). I'm assuming what you meant to say was 1080p? If so, yes, a 1080p 50" Pioneer just came out in July and more will be released before year's end-hopefully a 42" version. The new 50" 1080p Pioneer Elite looks beautiful as all hell, but almost 10 grand. If you have the bucks saved up, I'd hold off till New Years and see how much prices will come down because they WILL especially before Superbowl in February.

[Bernie]

Paul,

Forgot to mention that this year's Pioneer Elite plasma TVs including the newer 1080p sets will not have the separate media boxes, which was a nice feature because it meant only one cable to the panel itself-all video devices were connected to the media box and not the panel. Everything is now integrated on the panel itself so you'll now have multiple cables going behind the wall.

[K-Bee]

The plasma sets have been subject to a lot of misinformation (most of it planted by rival LCD and DLP manufacturers) that plasmas burn out after two years and get this: that the gas inside has to be recharged every so often! All of this is totally untrue, but many people believe this.

That's hilarious :lol: at least that was NOT the story my TV/Radio store friend told me.
Anyway, thanks for the heads up about this Bernie - i'll keep this in mind next time I'm looking for a new television set, which may even be sooner than I initially had in mind - my brand new x-box 360 looks crap on my old rusty traditional set.:(

[paul]

Paul,

Forgot to mention that this year's Pioneer Elite plasma TVs including the newer 1080p sets will not have the separate media boxes, which was a nice feature because it meant only one cable to the panel itself-all video devices were connected to the media box and not the panel. Everything is now integrated on the panel itself so you'll now have multiple cables going behind the wall.

I like the separate box approach. :roll:
Anyway thanks fore the clarification on 1080i vs 1080p. $10000 is more than I'd spent for a TV. $5000 is my limit.

[Videoskooter]

Paul, we just bought a Sony LCD with Bravia system and Live Colour Creation Backlight (the one underneath/€ 1799,00/81 cm screen) . We didn't go for Plasma as it is more expensive, uses more power and there's some cases of fires caused by 'em (proven fact, sorry Bernie).

It's a wonderful TV and we (finally) bought a Sony DVD-Recorder with it. In fact that's all we need. No Home-Cinema systems for us, just good sound and vision. Now Like K-Bee states: the Samsung is a good choice too and so is the LG.

[paul]

Paul, we just bought a Sony LCD with Bravia system and Live Colour Creation Backlight (the one underneath/€ 1799,00/81 cm screen) . We didn't go for Plasma as it is more expensive, uses more power and there's some cases of fires caused by 'em (proven fact, sorry Bernie).

It's a wonderful TV and we (finally) bought a Sony DVD-Recorder with it. In fact that's all we need. No Home-Cinema systems for us, just good sound and vision. Now Like K-Bee states: the Samsung is a good choice too and so is the LG.

Fire :o
I think that's the Sony I saw on display here. I'm not familiar with "underneath/€ 1799,00/81"
Compared to your old CRT, does the Sony LCD handle sports action like racing as smoothly?

[Videoskooter]

Yes, there are insurance reports over here of Plasma's heating up and implode.

That's our Sony:

- costs € 1799,00

- screen is 81 cm (is 31,89 Inches)

Good TV-set, I can tell you that. Saw the F1-report on it today and, man, you can see through the Pitbabes' panties, no kidding, such a clear and smooth image :icon_exclaim:

[Bernie]

I like the separate box approach. :roll:
Anyway thanks fore the clarification on 1080i vs 1080p. $10000 is more than I'd spent for a TV. $5000 is my limit.

The cost to make the separate media box and the extra cables added a few hundred dollars to the price of a Pioneer plasma so they chose to delete it from this year's lineup.

I didn't really clarify the differences between 1080i and 1080p except the price, but I figured you already knew the difference. If not let me know and I'll explain.

Since you are willing to commit $5,000. I would strongly tell you to wait till after New Years as you can do one of two things: get a new 42" 1080p near your price range or pick-up last year's 1080i for a lot less. I'd opt to wait for the 1080p version as it offers a better picture and it utilizes a different HDMI protocol / connector which the older 1080i panels won't.

[Bernie]

Paul, we just bought a Sony LCD with Bravia system and Live Colour Creation Backlight (the one underneath/€ 1799,00/81 cm screen) . We didn't go for Plasma as it is more expensive, uses more power and there's some cases of fires caused by 'em (proven fact, sorry Bernie).

Johan,

While it's true that plasmas use more power and run a little hotter, the issue of fire has nothing to do with the set being a plasma. You are referring to a bad batch of Philips plasma sets that had a faulty power supply. All I can say is stay away from Philips as they aren't great panels and the Ambi-lite is a silly gimmick.

I know your Sony LCD set very well as I have sold tons of the Bravia 40XBR1. The 40" goes for under $3,000. Sony even gives me as much as $50.00 in cash besides my commission to sell them. Even though I make a LOT more money selling someone a Sony Bravia, I show and sell more of the plasmas so that's saying a lot. Don't get me wrong, the Sony Bravia XBR is a nice set-for an LCD. The only time I have recommended one without reservation is when someone plans to put it into a room with a lot of sunlight or strong glare.

[Videoskooter]

The only time I have recommended one without reservation is when someone plans to put it into a room with a lot of sunlight or strong glare.

Bernie, can you explain that last sentence a little more plz?


Don't get me wrong on Plasma's. I use 8 of 'em on the breaker but I just don't want one in my trailer coz' of the rumors perhaps. Outdoors they work fine and they fixed on metal bars so in case of fire they can't do no much harm.

[paul]

I didn't really clarify the differences between 1080i and 1080p except the price, but I figured you already knew the difference. If not let me know and I'll explain.

Hey Bernie, I'd appreciate more info on 1080i vs 1080p. I have a vague knowledge but not enough to know what the hell I'm talking about :oops:
Thanks.

[Bernie]

Bernie, can you explain that last sentence a little more plz?

Johan,

Consumer level plasmas use real glass for their panels, which gives a better image, but can give off pretty severe glare from bright lights making the picture un-watchable in extreme situations. An LCD uses a cheaper and matte plastic screen, which reflects less and since it has a higher light output it works better in rooms with lots of sunlight or bright lighting.

If you look at the back of both panels you'll find that plasmas are made out of metal whereas the LCDs are all plastic. As long as you keep either away from drapes or anything flammable there should be no danger of fire from their heat output.

[Bernie]

Hey Bernie, I'd appreciate more info on 1080i vs 1080p. I have a vague knowledge but not enough to know what the hell I'm talking about :oops:
Thanks.

Paul,

Originally television could not show all of the lines that made up a picture at one time. In other words if a TV's resolution was 1,080 lines one would only see 540 lines for the first split second then immediately see the other 540 lines. it would happen so fast that the human eye is fooled into thinking it is seeing the entire 1,080 lines at once. The TV is only capable of alternating each half of the picture hence the term "interlace" or simply "i" as in 1080i.

Computers on the other hand enjoy a much sharper image because they are able to show all 1,080 (or higher) at one time. This is called "progressive" or simply "p" as in 1080p. Now that we have high definition (HD) TV that can output in progressive you are getting more of the image at once and with less flicker. I'd wait just a little longer and get 1080p as Sony's Blu-Ray will output a full 1080p stream.

[Videoskooter]

Bernie,

And what about DVD-Recorders? Mine has 160 GB on the hard disk. Of course I could have bought the one with 250GB but does that make any difference, except for the number of hours you can record (and I don't record that much).

I mean qualitywise?

[Bernie]

Bernie,

And what about DVD-Recorders? Mine has 160 GB on the hard disk. Of course I could have bought the one with 250GB but does that make any difference, except for the number of hours you can record (and I don't record that much).

I mean qualitywise?

Johan,

Have never dealt with DVD recorders so I can't provide much. Besides the hard drive size difference I'm sure there must have been some extra features on the step-up model as it is rarely just one thing. I would also imagine that you can upgrade the drive itself if you were to open the unit-at least I think.

[Bernie]

Here's a link to Pioneer's new 1080p plasma: PRO-FHD1
http://www.pioneerelectronics.com/pn...tailsComponent

and the 1080i PRO-940HD
http://www.pioneerelectronics.com/pn...624916,00.html

[Mixmachine]

Here are some of my personal findings on this subject..

After all my readings I find serious issues with all this micro digital displays technologies, and once again ‘convenience’ trumps quality as CRT based RPTV, after 30+ years of refinement are almost faced out..

I still recommend that if one doesn’t mind the boxy look (reduced in latest models) and can afford the extra space needed CRT based RPTV still is the best bang for your buck. You’ll get the best HD picture quality of any displays with the latest bells and whistles including HDMI connectivity for a fraction of the competitor's price, a 1080i 55-57 Hitachi and Mitsus are selling for around $1200, but hurry, this is apparently the last year (parts will be available by law for years to come), this way you can safe your money for about five years until better technology and more reliable displays come to market. Other pluses : Cheapest extended warranties and analog cable still looks ok.

Plasmas are next in PQ, if you must have 1080i they come at a premium, although 768P resolution still is considered HD and looks great. Costco has a 50” Vizio for $1899 that received great reviews on the Perfect Vision Mag, they use top of the line components and look great, Plasmas sharpness is said to fade over time, manufacturers claim the problem has been fixed, but you won’t know for sure until about 3 or four years later down the line, another issue here is ‘heat’, make sure you get a UPS as the unit could get fried during power outrage since they need two fans to cool down, also video games could cause ‘screen burn’ issues if brightness is kept to high. (just like CRT)

DLP/RPTV is next in line (1080p now), almost as good as plasmas, make sure your extended warranties covers several bulbs replacements, as they will blow!!! Black level are much better than LCD with rich colors, latest models are said to be much better. Check to see if you are susceptible to the "rainbow" effect, a phenomenom native to this technology. Forget analog Cable, you’ll need at least a Digital Package, probably nothing less than HDTV channels (and dvd) will do. (same for Plasma)

LCD has the worse reviews, they have the worse Black levels, this is important for film color accuracy (DVD) and instrumental in giving the HD image a 3D look (shadows, shades). They have problems with blown pixels that are not covered by warranty (unless a huge number of them), not good for video games, viewing angle is another problem., tip: if you turn off the display the immediate “black level” you see is the best the unit can do.

There is also JVC’s HD-ILA , 1080P , but I never followed this technology closely, lots of posters swear by it though…

I wouldn’t worry about 1080P as of yet, not even the latest HD-DVD players are able to reproduce this content yet (imbedded in current HD-DVD/Blue Ray disks for future use) the next player generation will reproduce 1080P (expensive at first) but HDTV Broadcasters have no plans to upgrade as of yet. In any case if you must have 1080P now make sure the display will accept a 1080P source, as the labeling can be confusing and /or mis-leading, many current advertised 1080p displays can only up-convert a signal to 1080p, not the same thing…

edit; I forgot, there is also the LCos displays, Sony has improved on this technology and calls it SXRD, many posters rave about the PQ. but again I 'm not up to date with this one.:roll:



PS: Bernie I dind't know you are an electronic salesman :p

[Videoskooter]

Mix, thx for the info but is this info of yours based on recent models? I think the latest Sony's (LCD) have dealt with the problems you describe.

But...since our new one is not yet delivered I can't give you a full test-result. Of course I can always change my order!

BERNIE, H-E-L-P P-L-Z :icon_question:

[Mixmachine]

Video, my friend , I hate to be the source of any buyers remorse:( but I can just report to you what I still read in oher forums and from my trusted "The Perfect vision" Magazine, the only one I bother with after trying all others for years.
Here is a piece from the Vizio Plasma review on issue 69 from the 2006 July/august edition by Lawrance E. Ullman

"...The flat panel Vizio even costs less than some DLP Rear projectors, and it doesn't exhbit the dreaded "rainbows" that viewers report when watching those sets. And in case you are wondering, no LCD panel even comes close, since they are smaller, more expensive and can't do black worth spit.":o
A bit to dramatic ? I was shock they are still saying this about LCD, but remember this guys review all kind of displays everyday.

let me check and see if they have a review of your sony model.

[Videoskooter]

Mix, "C-Net" has the following review:

http://reviews.cnet.com/Sony_KDL_32S...1694898-2.html

[Bernie]

Mix, "C-Net" has the following review:

http://reviews.cnet.com/Sony_KDL_32S...1694898-2.html

Johan,

The photo you showed several posts up was of the Bravia "XBR" series which is their top of the line Bravia that has a higher quality panel and a cable card slot. The C-Net review is of their lower Bravia "S" series.

Nonetheless, the Sony LCDs are very nice sets, but they are not on par with a good plasma.

Mix,

I'm a vinyl and analogue lover so I'm always open to older and superior technologies, but when it comes to TVs the CRT is pretty much dead and not worth the hassle. The few CRTs left are not of the highest quality anymore and getting a CRT based rear projection TV (RPTV) even less so with the issue of having to constantly set convergence, narrow viewing angles...