Rantings by a 40 yr old Disco Lover...

[mrbill]

This forum is evidence that Disco music from the 70's has staying power - no mass market power. Fads are for the mass market, quality
is for the few. 400 year old classical music is still sold and listened too as will the real "disco" music 400 years from now.

The shallow sheep who followed the latest "trend" can make stupid Saturday Night Fever poses, but the leaders are those who know what it was all really about - FUN. Music then was fun - it made you want to put on your boogie shoes (platforms, High Heels, or Loafers) and move - express yourself. Fun was the music, the attitude, the clothes.

People today dont have a clue of what it really means to get Funky. Sex? well maybe, but to be really funky you have to have a whole lot more than that.

Disco music was funky - be it "The Bertha Butt Boogie", "Tangerine", "Boogie Wonderland", "Love is the Answer", "Nights on Broadway", "Cafe", "Queen of Hearts", "Born to be Alive", "Climb", "Walking on Music" or "Rumor has it" - these songs and ones like them had funk.

The DJs today should be ashamed to call themselves "DJs". They are human interfaces utilized to operate spinning devices to project computerized sounds - no musical education required. Devoid of the
abilty to "weave a tale" with music, these mono-syllable/mono-sound "arteests" should be punished 40 years from now when they are in their wheelchairs by forcing them to listen to refuse they "spun" when
younger. Hell, my funeral will be a Disco party - who cares who is still around, atleast I will be leaving the place with my dancin' shoes still on!

I dont care if disco music ever re-attains the popularity it once had. It doesnt have to. It would be nice, but then so would alot of things. I wouldnt mind a few classy places to go were real-human music was
playing, but I always have my memories of what was. Those memories have kept me going for 25 years and will for another 25 years. As I turn 40 tomorrow, my love of the music has not waned. Still pure fun, classy, funky. Screw the meek sheep. Screw the moron President they sort of didnt elect, screw the previous screwing one as well. You get
what you ask for - bland politics - bland music. Though I am stuck with the President, I dont have to be stuck with the music.

Tom Moulton = GOD
Frankie Nuckle = Not GOD

Ill be listing to "Accidental Lover" and remember what going out "should" be....wink...wink... tonight before I trod once again to listen to tump...crash...tump...crash... re-looped to crash...tump...crash...tump.
When in the car, Ill push in the cassette and hear "Zake's Theme", "Disco Choo Choo" and "Hot Hot Give it all You got" - all energized and in a party mood only to be crushed by deep bass and house tracks.
Makes by 6" platforms wanna shrink :sad: Hanging out with clueless people
who are not really dancing to clueless music, "spun" by clueless
slackers. But, such is a night in Chicago.

[DanceMan]

On 2002-08-17 19:22, mrbill wrote:
This forum is evidence that Disco music from the 70's has staying power - no mass market power. Fads are for the mass market, quality
is for the few. 400 year old classical music is still sold and listened too as will the real "disco" music 400 years from now.

The shallow sheep who followed the latest "trend" can make stupid Saturday Night Fever poses, but the leaders are those who know what it was all really about - FUN. Music then was fun - it made you want to put on your boogie shoes (platforms, High Heels, or Loafers) and move - express yourself. Fun was the music, the attitude, the clothes.

People today dont have a clue of what it really means to get Funky. Sex? well maybe, but to be really funky you have to have a whole lot more than that.

Disco music was funky - be it "The Bertha Butt Boogie", "Tangerine", "Boogie Wonderland", "Love is the Answer", "Nights on Broadway", "Cafe", "Queen of Hearts", "Born to be Alive", "Climb", "Walking on Music" or "Rumor has it" - these songs and ones like them had funk.

The DJs today should be ashamed to call themselves "DJs". They are human interfaces utilized to operate spinning devices to project computerized sounds - no musical education required. Devoid of the
abilty to "weave a tale" with music, these mono-syllable/mono-sound "arteests" should be punished 40 years from now when they are in their wheelchairs by forcing them to listen to refuse they "spun" when
younger. Hell, my funeral will be a Disco party - who cares who is still around, atleast I will be leaving the place with my dancin' shoes still on!

I dont care if disco music ever re-attains the popularity it once had. It doesnt have to. It would be nice, but then so would alot of things. I wouldnt mind a few classy places to go were real-human music was
playing, but I always have my memories of what was. Those memories have kept me going for 25 years and will for another 25 years. As I turn 40 tomorrow, my love of the music has not waned. Still pure fun, classy, funky. Screw the meek sheep. Screw the moron President they sort of didnt elect, screw the previous screwing one as well. You get
what you ask for - bland politics - bland music. Though I am stuck with the President, I dont have to be stuck with the music.

Tom Moulton = GOD
Frankie Nuckle = Not GOD

Ill be listing to "Accidental Lover" and remember what going out "should" be....wink...wink... tonight before I trod once again to listen to tump...crash...tump...crash... re-looped to crash...tump...crash...tump.
When in the car, Ill push in the cassette and hear "Zake's Theme", "Disco Choo Choo" and "Hot Hot Give it all You got" - all energized and in a party mood only to be crushed by deep bass and house tracks.
Makes by 6" platforms wanna shrink :sad: Hanging out with clueless people
who are not really dancing to clueless music, "spun" by clueless
slackers. But, such is a night in Chicago.

First of all, MRBILL, HAPPY 40th BIRTHDAY!!!

wow - from the way you were talking - I thought you were at least 10 years older...you really took off into the disco mindset at a very young age....congrats!

secondly, thanks for mentioning "Cafe" and "Born To Be Alive"....two of my promo pushes back in the day....but I really want to tell you how I agree with what you said and couldn't have said it nearly as well without blowing a couple of fuses along the way....I have said it before and I will always say it that disco was not some fad and, as you said, much of it will be listened to and played at nightclubs-of-class for many centuries to come....and I hope to be there ringside tapping my cane to the beat....

[QUINNY]

With age comes a better grasp of realism. At 40, reality starts to kick in. Happy Birthday.

[Robbie]

Mrbill-

I was too young to have experienced the disco music when it was there (I was born in 1975), but I have to say that if it weren't for the smaller, independent labels like Salsoul, and mixers like Tom Moulton, disco wouldn't be what it would become.

I am an avid fan of Salsoul Records and the music that came off of that label. Recently I bought "Salsoul Classics 2: Vol. 3-4". While reading the liner notes, Tom Moulton had his hand at the majority of the records on that CD. I'm not sure if Moulton was ever a D.J., but I hear where you're coming from when it comes to D.J.'s today. Actually, two that I really liked were Jellybean and Larry Levan. I think Jellybean's mixes were out of this world (only because he was one of the very few who would play a record in its entirety and then mix with another record towards the end as opposed to the first break, which is the norm nowadays when spinning classics) and Larry's mixes on his "Paradise Garage" CD's were very good.

The D.J.'s today produce "cookie-cutter" music. A few years back, I used to buy some current club music. The maxi-singles were about 10 cuts long, with every mix conceivable. Honestly, these were unimaginative as you can get. One such outfit, called Club 69, had a sound that was prevalent on every record they mixed. It was the same, and never deviated away from their forumla. Not so much that, the music on the initial record wasn't the same, so it was as if they just kept the vocals and added their own music to it. But the D.J.'s who spin the classics today suck!! They use gimmicks throughout, and they are speeded up beyond belief. Sometimes they're unlistenable, and the thing I detest the most from them: they mix into another song after the first break. What is the point of that?? To me, that justifies the supposed notion of disco forever being a "disposable" music form. By the D.J.'s doing that, the records do indeed become "disposable"; they're on so shortly you can't appreciate them.

As much as I enjoy to hear the "Top 40" disco, the "underground", 12" disco is just more satisfying because there was so much good stuff that went unnoticed by the mass public. The Salsoul stuff is awesome and to this day it sounds so good!! That was a label that really paid attention to the club scene. As for Casablanca--their one-sided only records was only a means for making $$$ off of the buyers. I don't think they were ever concerned about the disco scene in general. Don't get me wrong; Casa put out some good stuff (Donna Summer, Alec Constandinos), but they weren't that dependent on mixers and club-oriented producers. Labels like Salsoul, Prelude and West End filled that void.

BTW--I enjoyed that WDAI countdown from October 1979.

[DanceMan]

On 2002-08-18 09:39, Robbie wrote:

I was too young to have experienced the disco music when it was there (I was born in 1975), but I have to say that if it weren't for the smaller, independent labels like Salsoul, and mixers like Tom Moulton, disco wouldn't be what it would become.

I am an avid fan of Salsoul Records and the music that came off of that label. Recently I bought "Salsoul Classics 2: Vol. 3-4". While reading the liner notes, Tom Moulton had his hand at the majority of the records on that CD. I'm not sure if Moulton was ever a D.J., but I hear where you're coming from when it comes to D.J.'s today. Actually, two that I really liked were Jellybean and Larry Levan. I think Jellybean's mixes were out of this world (only because he was one of the very few who would play a record in its entirety and then mix with another record towards the end as opposed to the first break, which is the norm nowadays when spinning classics) and Larry's mixes on his "Paradise Garage" CD's were very good.

Labels like Salsoul, Prelude and West End filled that void.

BTW--I enjoyed that WDAI countdown from October 1979.

Robbie...I was originally from NJ too....had I known you were a disco baby back in the day, I coulda carried you around on my shoulders to meet the DJ stars that you so craved....

I knew Jellybean when he looked like one...he was my replacement at Where It's At Magazine in 1977 as the Disco Upbeat reviewer, which I created. He lasted as long as the editor, Ronn Mullen's taste for Spanish food ran dry.....by the way, Jellybean has since married (hmmmm) and did he date Madonna?....like I dated Tom Moulton! (Think Liza Minellia and any husband)!

Actually, you are right...on record, JB was great; in the clubs, like Electric Circus and the FunHouse he kinda got boring as he played every song too long (which is fine at home while spinning his discs) but at the clubs his mixes can get rather tedious.....Larry was much more experimental...i found him either extremely exhilarating or too eclectic for me....He could go from "Love Is The Message" by MFSB - his Garage theme song....to Brainstorm in one fell swoop!....i liked the unpredicatble and he was never the same, miss the man....

Prelude was probably my favorite record label along with Salsoul, West End and Butterfly...they really cared for the disco audience big time and while sales mattered of course, they always thought with a disco state of mind.....the bigger labels had a lot more hits...but they had twice as many flops....Columbia would put a 12" on the Star Spangled Banner, had someone requested it....they had no idea....although Vince Pellegrino was probably one of the nicest, and sexiest straight top promo men in the biz at the time....he did his best but the bottom line was always the $$$....i guess if i were laying the blame on anyone for the disco backlash, a lot of the blame has to go to CBS, WEA, RCA and Polygram.....

[Robbie]

DanceMan--

When I was very young (before kindergarten), my mother bought "A Night At Studio 54" as well as Gloria Gaynor's "Love Tracks" and Peaches and Herb's "2 Hot!" albums, plus Village People's "Macho Man" album. I remember the days when she would have the "Saturday Night Fever" album playing in the living room as she'd be doing the cleaning and vacuuming around the house!! She also bought the 12" single of Herb Alpert's "Rise" and Donna Summer's "On The Radio" on 8-track. She listened to the disco music back then, thanks to my soon-to-be aunt, who was still a teenager back then. We lived in Queens, N.Y. at the time (up until the end of 1984).

Disco has always been a part of my life, and I listened to it even in my growing up years in the 80's. True, at that time we had Madonna, Lisa Lisa, Alisha, and others, but I always had a place for the 70s disco music.

You are so right about Levan's style as opposed to Jellybean's. I heard his "Live at the Paradise Garage" CD a while back, and was amazed at the selection of songs he chose to spin. I LOVE Ashford & Simpson's "Bourgie Bourgie" instrumental. That was a good opener. A lot of those songs he used I had never heard of before. Contrary to what is often said about DJ's discarding disco records after they had met its potential, throughout that CD you can hear him spinning Stephanie Mills' "Put Your Body In It" (1979) into Crown Heights Affair's "Dreaming A Dream" (1975) into Bunny Sigler's "By The Way You Dance" (1978).

I understand that sales were very crucial to a label's survival, but I'm sure Salsoul, Prelude, and West End lasted as long as they did because of the club audience reaction. I read about the history of the 12" single and it's amazing that these big record companies poured out so much $$$ for disco departments only to learn that the people preferred to buy the singles and not the albums. Then again, by 1979, many disco acts' albums were reaching Top 10 status on the album charts and being certified gold/platinum.

One such label that I think put out some good disco for a big label was RFC, Warner Bros.' disco label. They even put out a CD years back called "Club Floor Classics", which contained some WB/RFC tracks. They are all full-length and it's a good listen. I guess Polydor would be another one as well, but I think in those days it was a long-established label but not the mega-conglomerate label it is today. Their albums were good, and they had a good roster with Gaynor, Peaches and Herb, Alicia Bridges, etc.

Tom Moulton was an amazing mixer--his Salsoul work is so good!! I have to say that Salsoul disco makes me feel real good inside, and I'd say that for the majority of the music from that label. He even mixed/produced Grace Jones' "Portfolio", "Fame", and "Muse" albums; Vincent Montana did work on the "Fame" album as well.

I miss hearing Jellybean's mixes on WKTU here in N.Y. They haven't aired them in 4 years or so. Probably I'd think they might've ran too long had I been at the Fun House but when you're listening to it at home (like you said), it's a different experience.

I'm very fortunate I was born at a time when disco was just beginning to break out the way it did. It's something when the younger kids are into the music and I think to myself that they were born after it had seen its commercial/artistic heyday. At least I can say, "I was there!!" (in some respects).

[zeca azevedo]

Hey Mr. Bill,

WELCOME TO THE 40's CLUB! I turned 40 recently (july, 28). The 1962 class is THE BEST (LOL)!

Peace,

zeca azevedo

[Giovanni]

Hello guys,

here I am another 1962 born and love disco of course.

I am noticing a recent trend in this forum towards pathetic melancholy.... "we were best, young people of today don't enjoy their lifes" etc etc......

More or less, what I heard older people saying when we were 18 or 20 and that I hated so much!!!
"What the hell do they want to understand of us" I thought.....

PLEASE, let's refrain from making a similar error!!

Disco is OUR music because we're 40! I appreciate those younger people (in the forum or not) who like disco, but they are exception to the rule. Even when we were 20 there was someone who liked Elvis or 50s rock'n'roll.

I agree with all of us that disco has probably made the greatest impact on today's music (bigger than any other type of music) but we have to admit that, apart for our devoted love for disco, some of today's dance music (very often disco-derived, disco-filterd, disco-sampled) is wonderful.

Just to have an idea, if you don't, listen to:
http://www.gottahavehouse.com/
or
http://www.routesinrhythm.com/routes/index.html
or
http://bbs.media-unyc.com/Default.asp

[QUINNY]

GIOVANNI: WELL SAID THAT MAN. WE DO SOUND LIKE OUR PARENTS. THERE ARE A FEW GREAT RECORDS STILL BEING MADE, JUST LIKE THERE WERE A FEW GREAT RECORDS IN THE DISCO ERA.
THE TERM 'GREAT' IS BANDIED ABOUT TOO MUCH AND ULTIMATELY DEVALUES TRUE GREATNESS.

[ruoffended]

So house music is from the 80's and still alive and its still the same sound , So disco music is from the 70's and still the same sound and what! music is music its a matter of taste ! ...RU

[jitm]

As many of you, I am sooo, sooo glad to be a part of the 40's crowd. 1962 was a blessed year. I am also very happy to say that I am still a DJ playing at a Women's bar in Columbia, S.C. They are so easy to please and open minded. As long as there are vocals, they are
satisfied. Late at night gives me the opportunity to play the retro, and we have a great time. GOD BLESS DISCO and the 12 INCH!!!

[mrbill]

Seems like '62 is a special year indeed.

The more I think about it, dance music today is being driven by people with no real classical music training. A doubt few can play the guitar or piano. They can use a keyboard , click a few buttons and merge sounds together - but that is it. Very bland/unoriginal and definiately not catchy.

Most classic disco songs were multi-layered, arranged by talented TRAINED people and performed by proficient skilled musicans. Some groups were "garage band" types (Gary's Gang"), others mind-childs of producers who knew alot about music (THP, JM, AC), and others by arrangers with classical skills
(John Davis, Vincent Montana). All these types of inputs into the music produced diversity and when sucessful - fun sounding
music.

Looking at the old VH-1 clips of Studio 54, Xenon's or other famous discos, you saw an atmosphere of fun (decedent, erotic, classy).
It took effort to go to one of these places, it took effort to understand the music, it was a night-lifestyle.

Now its, pop your e-pill, consume plenty of
alcoholic beverages, and just shake. Dont forget the Goodwill outfit, floppy hat to cover your bloodshot eyes (okay to have red eye at 6:00AM), and puke skills.

But then, that is USA in 2002! Puke skills -
at the college dorm, nightclub, ball park.
Lame ***ed cretins. The pendulam shifted to
ultra-conservative and its lasted 20 years -
just wait - will swing back when AIDS is licked (I think that will be the catalyst).

One last note. Being in Chicago, and an eye-witness to "Disco-Demolition Night" at Cominskey Park, my view on why Disco "died" for the pop-culture agrees with most of what has been said by other posters/threads:

1) Gay backlash - tag something as "gay" and it will die in pop culture. Doesnt matter if it was multi-cultural, pan-sexual, diverse or anything cool. Throw the 3 letter word and if it sticks, it will die as far as the masses are concerned. Think what would happen if Brittney Spires was ever photographed in a "woman's bar"???

2) Ronnie Reagan and the Moral Majority ilk.
Enough said other than they should get the stick out of there poop-hole already.

3) AIDS killed the "sex-party" scene which was a popular activity at many discoteques. The paranoid masses refused to "be-wild" when the chance of death loomed. A bad black cloud I remember when in college...alot of hysteria, mis-information, black-listing.

The only reason I dont agree with is- that the music became too copy-cat. Hell, that always happens, just look at rap or trance. Give me a break, how may ways can you complain about poverty, strut with your 'hos
or loop the same sounds - almost all the songs are the same 4 notes over...and...over...and...over.... The movie
"The Last Days of Disco" was set right when I was to turn the magic 21 - nightclub age. And what was the theme of the movie? "The party was over", now power-suits, pure-greed,
moral chest bashing, picking on banana-republic dictators and the "WAR ON DRUGS."
Sure sounds like the party was over to me.
I was so depressed about this. I dont take drugs, could care less about pip-squeek dictators, have no interest in other people's sexual activity and think greed is the root of all evil. Where was my party?
Oh well, I have my records and I can still "re-live" the party when ever I want too. Too bad the rest jumped ship, they are drowning in boring, bland lives, not me.

Classic disco is the same as classic music of 400 years ago. Put together for the same reasons, with similar skills, and produced a
popular product. Quality will last, trash will be in the past. Now time for some MFSB....

[JussiK]

On 2002-08-20 22:18, mrbill wrote:
Looking at the old VH-1 clips of Studio 54, Xenon's or other famous discos, you saw an atmosphere of fun (decedent, erotic, classy).
It took effort to go to one of these places, it took effort to understand the music, it was a night-lifestyle.

Now its, pop your e-pill, consume plenty of
alcoholic beverages, and just shake. Dont forget the Goodwill outfit, floppy hat to cover your bloodshot eyes (okay to have red eye at 6:00AM), and puke skills.

I went to both Studio 54 and Xenon a couple of times out of curiosity and got to tell you those places were as far away from the real disco experience as McDonalds. Overdressed middle aged scenemakers sweating and dancing badly, trying desperately to come across as divinely decadent but only looking like saddos, that's what Studio 54 was like. Those folks just shook the same hopeless manner no matter what track was playing, they could not care less. It was all about coke, posing and acting like snot. Not about music. Xenon was slightly better but trust me it was no Paradise Garage, or Le Palace for that matter.

Clubs today at least here in Europe can be a lot of fun, filled with people who love to dance. Drugs - sure but that has always been going on. The djs today are generally far better educated musically than the late 70's ones. During the disco era there were geniuses for sure but you'd be lucky if your average dj was able to get a decent mix going - outside large metropolitan areas that is. Of course it can be argued that the music WAS better those days - it most definitely was if you ask me. Today's sounds are not bad either, though - you do get abstract levels of rhythmic sounds that are quite fascinating - plus simply good tracks like Cassius featuring Jocelyn Brown: I'm a Woman - kicking or what!?

[Blaxman]

On 2002-08-20 22:18, mrbill wrote:

The more I think about it, dance music today is being driven by people with no real classical music training. A doubt few can play the guitar or piano. They can use a keyboard , click a few buttons and merge sounds together - but that is it. Very bland/unoriginal and definiately not catchy.

Most classic disco songs were multi-layered, arranged by talented TRAINED people and performed by proficient skilled musicans.

Mrbill,

I agree with you in this point. Just Perfect view of today's dance music (with few exceptions).

Peace