Maradonna's latest embarrasment.

[sutnop]

On 2002-07-03 10:11, Ricardo_Mata wrote:
Sutnop: I think you are losing this argument, my friend.

If I remember correctly, you are Argentinian, right? I understand your position defending Maradonna because he is one of your countrymen. However, you are trying to defend a lost cause. Maradonna was a source of pride in the late 70's and into the early 80s. I admired the guy when he started becoming famous but that changed when his attitude and his multiple other problems began to show. For me and may others around the world, he was a role model until he began to show that in reality he is nothing but a miserable, lousy jerk.

Let's go back to 1986 and the "Hand of God." That hand will be memorable because it became an undeserved goal. A true gentleman would have admitted IMMEDIATELY that he used his hand and that the goal should not count.

Nano is right, Argentina scored a second goal and won. However, the match is remembered not by that second goal which was a truly memorable and outstanding display of Maradonna's techinque. The match is remembered by the "Hand of God" and the undeserved goal it became. Had Maradonna admitted that he had used his hand and that the goal should not have counted, that game and Maradonna himself would have become the epitome of honesty, decency, and fair play. He had that opportunity and wasted it in the same way he wasted many others, including the '94 World Cup.

Has Maradonna done anything to me personally? Has he caused me any harm? No, he hasn't but he has harmed the sport I adore by tarnishing its image. And he has tarnished the image of a country I love and respect --your country!-- with his erratic, troubled behavior.

My friend, Argentina has not reason to be proud of Maradonna. If Argentina wants reasons to be proud, think of JosÈ de San MartÌn --in my opinion, an individual far greater and much more noble than Bolivar. And I am from Venezuela!

For a sense of pride, Argentinians should talk about Jorge Lugones, Jorge Luis Borges, Carlos Gardel, Carlos LÛpez Buchardo, Alberto Ginastera, and perhaps even Batistuta but not that pile of crap named Maradonna.

First of all I do not live in Argentina
and where I live he is remebered for the second goal
and it is considered the most amazing goal throughout history
If I was to pick out another Great Argentinan I wouldn't put the ones you mentionend put
Alfredo Di Stefano

Anyway back to the matter at hand
Saying he tarnished football.
I think The Germans, Norweigans and Beligans have been tarnishing footballs image for as long as I can remember by playing
BORING EFFECTIVE UNATTRACTIVE FOOTBALL!!

A Crime far greater then the crimes of Maradona.

But I think he are to different to agree on this point....

Since for Me men like
Al Capone
or Pablo Escobar

are a source of inspiration
because they got character
Perhaps they are inmoral or unethical
even unjust
brute and cold
Even what you might consider the synnomnym for EVIL

But Nevertheless they have got Character
and so does Maradona.....

[Ricardo_Mata]

Sutnop: I think I now understand why you like Maradonna so much. You both are exactly the same. You two make a good couple, well deserving of each other.

[Nano]

OK guys, I think it's time to put this topic to an end. From the start I read really offensive things, like wanting someone to die... That's not the way to talk about anyone. Ricardo seems to be a bit obsessed with Diego (it's not the first time he brings this up). And this discussion (even as I agree with most of Sutnop's words) has gotten to the point when nobody hears each other's arguments.
Just for the record people from Brazil, England and other countries, I'm going to say this just once:
1) Maradona is not a role model, but he didn't want to become one either. Blame the people who put a microphone near his mouth.
2) Maradona is not "guilty" of his drug addiction. That's a sickness anyone of us could have, so let's watch our mouths.
3) I see people complaining on the "hand" goal. From where? Well, I see there are some from Brazil and England! Maybe they're still suffering. Nobody in Argentina remembers that goal, because we had seen lots of fake goals, fake penalties and such on many matches of many tournaments, and done by all kinds of teams. A true football fan does not cry for them, just accept them as a given. That's the rule of the game: the referee decides, and sometimes he may be wrong. Think about all the times your team was benefitiated and you didn't protest (that's for you Brazilians!). I don't blame Codesal for the 1990 final, but Maradona has the right to talk whatever he thinks as anyone of us.
4) All Argentinians have the second goal in our minds, because that kind of thing doesn't happen too often, nor is it easy to accomplish.
5) Nobody deserves someone desiring death for him on this forum. This is gross, fellas, and the worse for coming from someone with Christian beliefs.
So: just cope with your feelings, and don't hurt others.

[sutnop]

Thanks Nano
I couldn't of expressed it better myself

I was waiting for you to say something

Maradona was not ever my favorite player during the 90 World Cup I even disliked him.
For his sly arrogance

But thats him and we have to respect it.
Just As I try To Respect the others on this forum (I know I fail sometimes) but I try...

So let me be the first to apologise if anyone feels insulted by what I have written

But I just thought it was quite wrong to call one of the sports greatest players through time,
a liability
Football surely wouldn't of been the same without him....

He never asked to be a role model

YEt in Napoli they treat him as a Demi God
NExt to
The Holy Mary
(and those people are catholics)

I mean for them he is an icon

And they see him as a human!
All humans have imperfections....
None of us are 100% evil
As none of us are 100% good

The People of Napoli worship Maradona because unlike the other saints he has flaws even many of them....
he has a tuff life....
but he has passion and that passion he gives back to the people when he is playing

[Ricardo_Mata]

Friends, I don't know if I should laugh or cry at this point. I'll laugh because some of what has been said in the last few messages is just too stupid to be taken seriously. I quote:

"Maradona is not a role model, but he didn't want to become one either. Blame the people who put a microphone near his mouth." My friends, with every position of importance and influence come responsabilities. Nobody can pretend to be a super star in any field and expect to evade that responsability. Maradonna wanted to be a star but didn't want to be held accountable for his actions? Very typical of people who are not ready nor qualified for their roles.

"Maradona is not "guilty" of his drug addiction. That's a sickness anyone of us could have, so let's watch our mouths." Nano, please tell me this is a slip of the tongue! Drug-addiction is a disease??? Tuberculosis, cancer, and leukemia are diseases. An addiction to drugs is nothing more than the lack of character and willpower to overcome the physical and mental attachment to chemical substances. Some people have used drugs, didn't like them and simply walked away from them. Some of us have have had the strength to stay away from drugs completely. Are you going to tell me that somebody has been forcing Maradonna to use drugs???

Come on fellows, admit that this lousy piece of junk was at one time a magnificent player who couldn't handle success and became a total embarrasment to the sport he claimed to love, to his country, and to himself.

As far as I am concerned this issue is over. I have wasted enough time trying to get across a point that evidently is too much for some people to accept and handle.

[Blaxman]

Hey guys, hold on!!!!!

Nano, Sutnop, Ricardo!! Please, listen to me.
I consider all of you gentlemen and good guys and good friend of mine, ok? In no one moment I did want to be agressive here. I was teasing Maradona while football player, not as person. I dont care if he is this or that. This topic is about sport, fair play remember........let's do our jokes fairly.

Ok, my jokes starts here:

- Oooops, I said "Fair Play".....but....use your hand to score a goal is not really fair. :lol: (sorry, Maradona fans)

- Nano, Brazil helped by the referees??? I cant remember!!! :lol: (ok, I must admit, my memory is pretty weak)

- Ok, I finally admit: Maradona is the biggest player in the world. Look at his shape!!! :lol:

Peace, I said PEACE!!

[jazz_pilgrim]

On 2002-07-03 10:11, Ricardo_Mata wrote:

Let's go back to 1986 and the "Hand of God." That hand will be memorable because it became an undeserved goal. A true gentleman would have admitted IMMEDIATELY that he used his hand and that the goal should not count.

Nano is right, Argentina scored a second goal and won. However, the match is remembered not by that second goal which was a truly memorable and outstanding display of Maradonna's techinque. The match is remembered by the "Hand of God" and the undeserved goal it became. Had Maradonna admitted that he had used his hand and that the goal should not have counted, that game and Maradonna himself would have become the epitome of honesty, decency, and fair play. He had that opportunity and wasted it in the same way he wasted many others, including the '94 World Cup.

Agreed 100% Ricardo!!!

You may remember only the second goal in Argentina, but that first goal will NEVER be forgotten in England. The second goal will never be forgotten either, as it was a magnificent goal. But Ricardo is right - Maradona tarnished his reputation that day and never recovered from it.

The BBC were showing a replay of the whole England v Brazil game from 1970 a couple of weeks ago. There was a moment when Brazil had a free kick, took the free kick very cleverly, but Bobby Moore anticipated the move and ran into position brilliantly to intercept the ball. You could see Pele APPLAUDING Bobby Moore for his excellent defensive work.

[Nano]

On 2002-07-03 21:14, Ricardo_Mata wrote:
An addiction to drugs is nothing more than the lack of character and willpower to overcome the physical and mental attachment to chemical substances. Some people have used drugs, didn't like them and simply walked away from them. Some of us have have had the strength to stay away from drugs completely.

I STRONGLY differ with you. It's evident we have different views on life, Ricardo. But I give up on this, I came here for fun.
Blax, a few years ago Brazil won a game to Argentina (played in Montevideo) with a goal made with the player's hand (maybe it was River against a Brazilian club for the Libertadores, frankly I don't remember well). The player had an U on the name, frankly I can't be precise but I remember we were all pissed (and Brazilians cheered remembering that Diego hand!) Anyway, time passed and I had forgotten completely until this topic came up.
I remember a TV show where a journalist tried to play "decent" against a group of football players. He said he regretted Diego's "hand goal" and hadn't cheered it at the time. All the players laughed at him! They said that things happen and the player knows he can be punished for that if the referee sees it (so he takes a risk when he's doing it). They couldn't believe the journalist regretted that Argentina was beating England! Me neither.
Anyway, Maradona is fat and tends to do pathetic things to attract the TV cameras. (But nobody said he praised the U.S. team!)
-------------------------------------------
About Napolitans: when Argentina played against Italy in 1990, the match took place in Naples, where Diego was playing for the Napoli (3 times champion for the first time in Italy's history). The Napolitans put a huge flag that read: "Diego, Naples loves you, but Italy is our own country (patria)!" They were apologizing to him for cheering the other team!
But it's OK, I give up, I give up. Move to other topics.

[Blaxman]

On 2002-07-04 19:13, Nano wrote:

Blax, a few years ago Brazil won a game to Argentina (played in Montevideo) with a goal made with the player's hand (maybe it was River against a Brazilian club for the Libertadores, frankly I don't remember well). The player had an U on the name, frankly I can't be precise but I remember we were all pissed (and Brazilians cheered remembering that Diego hand!)

Nano, I remember that game (vaguely), the player was Tulio, his team I cant remember but I can tell you: On that game I was supporting RIVER!! In fact I was supporting River against Gremio (I hate Gremio) on the last game for Libertadores !!! Believe me, I did wish River win that game scoring 3 goals with the hand of any of his players. :lol:

That's football things, inst it?

Peace.




_________________
SENHORES DO GROOVE - BRAZIL

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Blaxman on 2002-07-05 07:52 ]</font>

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Blaxman on 2002-07-05 07:53 ]</font>