A difficult choice: Diana Ross or Florence Ballard

[Marcio**]

In 1964 Berry Gordy had to make a difficult choice: Diana Ross or Florence Ballard as lead vocal of the Supremes. Carolynn Gill of the Velvelettes says: "It was Berry's choice to put Diana as lead. I think Diana's voice appealed to Berry because it was young, crisp commercial sound; maybe Flo's voice was a little to strong for that time. I don't think Berry chose Diana because he particularly liked her more than the other girls. They were after all high school kids to him"



detnews.com

www.history-of-rock.com/supremes.htm

[DoctorDisco]

To paraphrase a Supreme's song.....Flo...She don't know.

[markydefad]

Originally Posted by DoctorDisco

To paraphrase a Supreme's song.....Flo...She don't know.

:lol: :lol: :lol: My fave line from a Supremes song EVER!!!!! :lol: :lol: :lol:

Is it just me or does Miss Ross looks strangely like Little Richard in that photo????!!! :oops:

[judydoggie]

Sure, Ms. Ross's public troubles are now getting to the point where they may soon eclipse Liza Minelli's.

Let's set it all aside and listen to the voice. There's an obscure hit from a vinyl album I've long lost but that I was delighted to find on their "Diana Ross and the Supremes - The Ultimate Collection." The song is No Matter What Sign You Are. Beside the song being a danceable classic (structure-wise) Ms. Ross displays her vocal pyrotechnics in a way I don't recall ever having heard her on any other cut.

Now, some may call it out-and-out screaming. But IMHO, it's done straight-on accurate (pitch wise) and makes the song so much more exciting.

Florence Birdsong did a great job and performed well. Diana Ross is far from my favorite singer -- in fact, I believe her best, most singular (from a vocal standpoint) work was done before the disco era; or in the R&B genre. Birdsong was a fine singer but no Diana Ross.

- Paul (a.k.a. judydoggie)

[Mario]

Hello Guys... I've always read with great interest the Diana vs. Flo arguement. From what I've gathered, when the Supremes were first formed, there was no lead singer. All three ladies, including Mary Wilson, took turns singing leads on various cover versions of early 60's records. Many music historians claim that Florence had the most "soul" in her voice and was the strongest of the three ladies vocally. You can hear Florence Ballard on lead in the Supremes hit: Buttered Popcorn... And, wow, she really did have a set of pipes! However, Barry Gordy decided to "package" Diana as the upfront lead because of the three ladies, Diana sounded the most "white." Barry was no fool as the early 60's was full of a lot of racial tensions...Barry selecting Diana to sing lead was a political as well as successful move on Barry's part; it was Barry's orchestrated way of further introducing black music to white audiences...And it worked! P. S. Mary Wilson could/can carry a tune or two quite well...Mary demonstrates her vocal abilities best as she leads on a cover version of Martha Reeves and the Vandella's "Come and Get These Memories." Take Care....Mario 8)

[judydoggie]

How sad, Mario. You're right. The times were right for Diana Ross -- the girl with the least 'soul' in her voice of all three. Today, the tables would be turned. How ironic.

Those days, Gordy wanted someone who sounded white. These days, little suburban rich white kids are dressing like (and listening to) gangsta-rappers of color. DISCLAIMER: "Gangsta-Rap" is not my bag, but I'm not pro or con any of it; let whatever will be will be.

- Paul a.k.a. Judydoggie

[Bona boy]

I thought it was simply that Berry picked La Ross because he was poking her at the time. :D

[judydoggie]

Oh, my dear! MUST we get into such detestable subjects as the pleasures of the flesh herein?! I thought that this was a forum about pristine and noble artistic pursuits -- such as music!

Are you intimating that Ms. Ross's career was advanced because she gave up manifold and delightful sexual favours to Mr. Gordy?! My goodness -- some writers of books on the entertainment business have called this phenomenon the "casting couch?"

I just simply refuse to believe that any such concept exists in any of the performing arts. I'm a struggling singer. I have yet to have a recording contract executed. And many people who've heard me say I'm pretty good. Yet there's another young man who's voice resembles the mating call of certain lesser mammals. My agent tells me it has to do with his "big ten inch." It was my belief that ten-inch records went out with 78-rpm recordings... is there something I don't know. I'd love to hear any advice group members can offer about this situation.

Sincerely yours,

Judydoggie

[DoctorDisco]

Dear Miss Judydoggie,

I believe the big "ten inch" record you refer is an old song that has been covered by many artists.

Surely it doesn't have some hidden meaning.

Doctor Disco

[Marcio**]

Berry & Ross
Just Friends :)

[KayJayEm54]

I've heard you cannot beat a 12" (anyone care to disagree?????) It is even better than the 10" as you get a far longer vibe but don't go for the stuffed crust as it damages the stylus!!

We are talking pizzas here aren't we???

[Bona boy]

Really, hasn't anyone heard that it isn't the size that matters, it's what you do with it.

[trish]

Originally Posted by Bona boy

I thought it was simply that Berry picked La Ross because he was poking her at the time. :D

That was definitely part of it, but he wanted someone who could cross over to the pop charts. He wanted Diana to be on the same level as Barbra Streisand. Flo's voice was to black. He wanted Flo to go along with the change and not cause trouble. She spoke up for herself, caused tension, started drinking and put on some weight so he got rid of her.

I think maybe had they handled it differently it could have been resolved without Flo having to leave the group.

Diana's oldest daughter is Berry's child.

[eddie]

I don't think the Supremes were produced right. I think they should have changed up lead singers within the song like Kendricks and Ruffin on "You're my everything." They weren't even my favorite female Motown group and I favor their 70's output over their 60's tracks with Miss Ross. Martha and the Vandellas had a more soulful sound.

[trish]

Originally Posted by eddie

I don't think the Supremes were produced right. I think they should have changed up lead singers within the song like Kendricks and Ruffin on "You're my everything." They weren't even my favorite female Motown group and I favor their 70's output over their 60's tracks with Miss Ross. Martha and the Vandellas had a more soulful sound.

You are absolutely right. I never understood why Berry was so adamant about Diana being the only lead. I too thought Martha and the Vandellas had a more soulful sound, but that is the sound Berry did not want the Supremes to have. That IMHO is why Florence was put in the position of singing background.