DJ's: Producing and marketing your own CD's

[Nano]

I think Rab's is a good idea, and in fact it's been done. Maybe not in an all-disco CD, but look at the mix CDs of Dimitri from Paris, Prodigy or the Chemicals "Brothers gonna work it out". They tend to put some Cerrone or Costandinos inbetween the hard techno beats of today. Prodigy even included a Sex Pistols track! And that must cost a bloooody lot, isn't it Mr. "Filthy Lucre" Lydon?
So maybe it can be done. Of course, it's easier if you are a fashion European DJ star...

[NickNack]

Originally Posted by markydefad

And I'm fascinated by the legendary stories of DJ ego and bad temperament--like Larry Levan playing one record repeatedly over and over and over and over--UNTIL he got the reaction from the crowd he felt the record deserved!!!! Unheard of to me--punishing your dancers--and STILL they came!!! That's a cult of DJ personality that I find most interesting.

Larry's repeated playing of a song is just another example of technique taken from Nicky Siano and credited to Mr.Levan.

When Nicky wanted to 'promote' a song at The Gallery, you would hear it "a lot". If the record was at a certain tempo where it would fit nicely throughout the evening, then prepare yourself. He wanted you to get into it.

Nicky also did something else that was brazen, and also stolen: Once in a great while, if he flubbed a mix, he would immediately mix back into what he just came out of and then repeat the mix correctly. It startled the crowd but they loved it! I'm sure Larry did that at The Garage. I know I did it at The Anvil. Sometimes you just got to prove yourself :lol: .

It just amazes me that so many of the Garage members were Gallery members and they still credit Larry with, well, IMO, a lot of "style" that is truly not original.

[QUINNY]

Nicky: I don't know if anyone would actually want the dubious honour of being known as the DJ who played a track repeatedly in order to break it. :lol:
You know what is said, innovators rarely get noticed.

Back on track.
If Disco is to find a larger audience it will probably be when internet radio takes off, leading to a large syndicated terrestrial radio station then picking up on the vibe and spreading the word. Will that happen? I very much doubt it, unless the over 50's get vocal and angry. I suspect disco will have a brief comeback, rather akin to the recent hullaballou that was caused by that very small, niche Big Band trip in NY. Suddenly, even national TV news in the UK, was proclaiming that Big Band was the latest thing in NY. HYPE, HYPE, HYPE, HYPE, HYPE.
Salsa is the one 'old' music that truly appears to have grabbed a multitude of people lately and grown in strength (over the past 5 years or so). To stay relatively hip (with a wide cross section of ages) after so long is amazing. The BBC even has people dancing Salsa as one of its main TV channel (BBC1) station idents.

[StuckIn1979]

Interesting thread...I'm seeing a lot of bootlegging on plain labels of some of this old stuff from the late 70's. I think bootlegging is justified, if you can't get it any other way. This old stuff should be repressed.

[Lardarz]

Regarding Larry Levan's mixing:

You have to bear in mind that this guy was using crap turntables, not technics or anything and was mixing tracks that were not produced to be mixed and had dramatically different tempos. As a result, and bearing in mind that he was a pioneer of mixing, you have to give him credit for effectively "creating" club DJing as it is today.
If you have tried mixing disco yourself you will notice that it is very hard to keep the beats in time as they are not at a constant bpm either. The beat is controlled by a human drummer, not a drum machine so there is naturally fluctuation in the tempo. Mixing 2 tracks that do this is very difficult and constant adjustment is required. With a lot of practice, I have managed to do it so it sounds reasonable at best. Mixing house is MUCH easier.
Technically, the Larry Levan mix from the Paradise garage is not great by modern standards, but the programming, the "way" he plays these records and the order in which he plays them, is inspirational.

Regarding current Disco mixed cd's:

Derrick Carter has just released a really good mix cd of old disco stuff on the Azuli label called "Choice". Francois K and Tony Humphries have also released"Choice" cd's. These are really good mixes of old school house, funk and disco and i would recommend them.

Others to watch out for are the Francois K "essential" CD, the Unabombers "Saturday Night, Sunday Morning" CD, and Dimitri From Paris's "Night At The Playboy Mansion Vol 1".

[VirtuallyThere]

OK, here is my offering. 2 CD's (remixed 3:00 per song avg.) of non stop disco dance classics. Added sound effects and song bits & pieces. Lucky if you sit down more than two songs. Anyway, these CD's truly capture what i remember from back in the day. Heart stomping, master mixing and great selection.

Virtually There CD1
01) Stratavarious - I Got Your Love
02) Vicki Sue Robinson - Turn The Beat Around
03) Evelyn Champagne King - Shame
04) Ring The - Savage Lover
05) Kat Mandu - The Break
06) Lime - Come And Get Your Love
07) Shake your Groove Thang
08) Paul Jabara - Honeymoon In Puerto Rico
09) Barry White - My First, My Last, My Everything
10) Arpeggio - Love and desire
11) USA-European Connection - Come Into My Heart
12) Amant - If There's Love
13) Miquel Brown - So Many Men So Little Time
14) Voyage - From East To West
15) Giorgio Moroder - From Here To Eternity
16) Pattie Brooks - After Dark
17) Isley Brothers - Who's That Lady
18) Voyage - Souvenirs
19) South Shore Commission - Free Man
20) O'Jays - I Love Music
21) Harold Melvin & The Blue Notes - Where Are All My Friends
22) Linda Clifford - If My Friends Could See Me Now
23) Gary's Gang - Keep On Dancing
24) Kano - I'm Ready
25) Tavares - Dont take away the music
26) Love and Kisses - I Found Love (Now That I Found You)
27) Reflections - Three Steps From True Love
28) Alec Costandinos - Romeo & Juliet

Virtually There CD2
01) Sparks - Beat The Clock
02) Joneses - Sugar Pie Guy
03) Blue Magic - Look Me Up
04) Ultra Nate - Desire
05) Mighty Clouds Of Joy - Tme
06) A Taste Of Honey - Boogie Oogie Oogie
07) Tempest Trio - Love Machine
08) Main Ingredient - Happiness Is Just Around The Bend
09) Salsoul Orchestra - Ooh I Love It
10) Cory Daye - Pow Wow
11) Salsoul Orchestra - Salsoul Hustle
12) Gene Page - Love Starts After Dark
13) GQ - Disco Nights
14) Salsoul Orchestra - Tangerine
15) Tavares - It Only Takes A Minute
16) Carol Jiani - Ask Me
17) Yambu - Sunny
18) Janice McClain - Smack Dab In The Middle
19) Trammps - Zing Went The Strings Of My Heart
20) Trammps - That's Where The Happy People Go
21) Teddy Pendergrass - The More I Get The More I Want
22) Barrabas - Woman
23) Softones - That Old Black Magic
24) Ritchie Family - The Best Disco In Town

[NickNack]

Originally Posted by Lardarz

Regarding Larry Levan's mixing:

You have to bear in mind that this guy was using crap turntables, not technics or anything

Excuse me? Where are you getting this information :o ? If any of us were using 'crap' turntables it was those of us working the smaller venues. Paradise Garage gave Larry everything he asked for. He helped design the system. If Larry didn't have his say on what was in the booth, he would threaten not to play. Please, I don't think he was asking for or using crap.

and was mixing tracks that were not produced to be mixed and had dramatically different tempos.

As were all of us at the time. It was no big deal. That's the way music was made and we learned how to play it. We didn't expect perfect tempos because there was no such thing. Beat mixing today is no thrill. Try it with some real music.

As a result, and bearing in mind that he was a pioneer of mixing, you have to give him credit for effectively "creating" club DJing as it is today.

And now we've really reached the fork in the road. Larry, a pioneer of mixing? Larry, creating club DJ'ing? :roll: I don't think so! There were too many before him to give him these credits. Larry gained fame, true, when the importance of the DJ in the club was finally recognized. But in the beginnings, he was running and funning around with the rest of us, taking time to listen to as many other established DJ's as he could. Because of his friendships with Nicky Siano and Frankie Knuckles he got to know and hear a lot. Siano trained Larry! How many times does this have to be said before people begin to lower this pedestal they've got him on?

If you have tried mixing disco yourself you will notice that it is very hard to keep the beats in time as they are not at a constant bpm either. The beat is controlled by a human drummer, not a drum machine so there is naturally fluctuation in the tempo. Mixing 2 tracks that do this is very difficult and constant adjustment is required. With a lot of practice, I have managed to do it so it sounds reasonable at best. Mixing house is MUCH easier.

I already addressed this. Like I said, it was, and still is, no big deal. Difficult to a generation who didn't have to do it perhaps (and we've talked about this on the board) but not for those who were there.

Technically, the Larry Levan mix from the Paradise garage is not great by modern standards, but the programming, the "way" he plays these records and the order in which he plays them, is inspirational.

These are the same props normally given to David Mancuso of The Loft, and deservedly so. Why? Because David never aspired to beat-match his music. He always let the music speak for itself. If Larry is to be 'the god' behind the turntables, then (IMO) he can't be 'inspirational' without having the tech skills. Other DJ's were held to that standard. So he should be, too.

Here are a few "inpirational pioneers" who could mix:

Bobby "DJ" Guttadaro
Richie Kaczor
Roy Thode
Tee Scott
Richie Rivera
Tom Savarese
Nicky Siano
Jimmy Stuard
Larry Sanders
Eddie Rivera
John Luongo
Walter Gibbons
Larry Patterson
Larry Rossiello

[originalbigm]

Quote:
"It was no big deal. That's the way music was made and we learned how to play it. We didn't expect perfect tempos because there was no such thing. Beat mixing today is no thrill. Try it with some real music."

Agreed.It probably is a bitch for the new generation as a majority of the music today maintains a constant BPM as opposed to fluctuations in the tempo created with real muscians and their instruments.Nicknack's got it right.It was no big deal for us old DJ's who evolved with the music.The real test was in the ability for a DJ to select the the appropiate tune that would mix in and retain the tempo and mood on the floor or elevating it to a higher level.We all got our high from pulling that off.

[markydefad]

It's always tres amusant ("very amusing" to the non-Frenchies :lol: ) to me, whenever I hear today's "DJ" complaining "how hard it is to mix the old classic disco"!!!

DUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUH!!!!!

Yeah, it was HARD--and that's why not EVERYONE could do it, unlike today. You had to practice this stuff and practice and practice and even then many, myself included, wouldn't dare attempt it in public. IT WAS HARD!!!! Only the BEST were able to to it for a living. That's why we revered them. :D

Today, any kid can mix pre-fabricated beats together. It's easy. And yet, today the DJ is revered as a "SUPERSTAR"!!!

All they do is cut and paste and
"deconstruct" previously interesting tracks into boring, unlistenable mush. :evil:

[Rab]

You have to bear in mind that this guy was using crap turntables, not technics or anything and was mixing tracks that were not produced to be mixed and had dramatically different tempos.

Reading Lardarz response really emphasizes the lack of understanding among newer disco enthusiasts today of what was going on back in the late 1970's. To say that the 12's singles produced back then were not produced to be mixed??? The whole reason 12" singles existed was for them to be mixed. This response epitomizes that, the whole aspect of mixing has been lost among todays DJ's. It is so sad....and so sad that there is so few of us left that remember how it used to be...

To listen to all this techno shit in today's clubs; and to think these DJ's think mixing this stuff is talent?

[markydefad]

The technology of today has reduced music production to a simple set of rules..the same beat...the same instrumentation...the same synth chords and electronic drum beat....reduced to such a level of simplicity that a 5 year old could mix with a weekend's training.

Back in tha day....WE HAD DIFFERENT STYLES OF MUSIC, created by DIFFERENT PRODUCERS, using DIFFERENT INSTRUMENTATION, with VARYING BEATS...the DJs JOB WAS TO TAKE THESE DISPARATE and SEEMINGLY UNLIKELY TO FIT PIECES and SEAMLESSLY MAKE THEM FLOW INTO EACH OTHER". And they did.

That's why we still revere the greats.

[QUINNY]

Maybe Discos (and dance music) would be more interesting today if mixing, heavy pounding 4/4 beats et al, hadn't been propogated way back then?

Old Fogeyitis alert!
Every generation has its heroes that previous generations denounce as being less gifted. We're just the wrong side of 50, eh?

[Mixmachine]

Originally Posted by Lardarz

Regarding Larry Levan's mixing:

You have to bear in mind that this guy was using crap turntables, not technics or anything ".

Maybe our young friend doesn't know, but the original 1200 Technics TT were available back then, they were designed for radio play and very expensive, but top clubs of the day could always afford them. This turntables were as good as the new 1200MK2 for club mixing and many Deejays prefered and kept them until they wore out.

[born2disco]

Today, any kid can mix pre-fabricated beats together. It's easy. And yet, today the DJ is revered as a "SUPERSTAR"!!!

All they do is cut and paste and
"deconstruct" previously interesting tracks into boring, unlistenable mush.

erm..... right. I agree it's not hard to beat-mix these days, but there is a lot of skill and talent in being able to mix cleverly and to take the punter on a journey on the dancefloor.... and yes, I agree that most "Superstar" DJs are boring. But you are sounding like an old fart. There are loads of fantastic house DJs.... mainly unknowns without egos who rock our local discos every weekend.

[QUINNY]

[quote="born2disco"]

There are loads of fantastic house DJs.... mainly unknowns without egos who rock our local discos every weekend.

Let's hear it for the boyz!!!!! The unsung heroes. There's no denying that the quality of yer average DJ far exceeds that of 25 years ago. After all, they have all the combined knowledge to learn from. IMO, in provincial England, the general standard of DJing was pretty poor until the late '80s. I may have been one of the pioneers and rightfully think that we did something special, but I ain't so stupid to think that we were perfect or somehow superior.

Even though the beats are in a very narrow BPM range, and some records are almost identical in every way, I have nothing but admiration for today's jocks. Of what I've heard, the mixing is soooooo flawless and incredibly well thought out.
Maybe even I could do it?